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What it Means to be a Socialist

Chris Hedges gave the following speech in Orange County, California yesterday (Sunday, 20 September).
"We live in a revolutionary moment. The disastrous economic and political experiment that attempted to organize human behavior around the dictates of the global marketplace has failed..."

"We will, as Friedrich Engels wrote, make a transition to either socialism or barbarism. If we do not dismantle global capitalism we will descend into the Hobbesian chaos of failed states, mass migrations—which we are already witnessing—and endless war..."

Hedges then explains how all socialists oppose "the psychosis of permanent war":
"First and foremost, all socialists are unequivocal anti-militarists and anti-imperialists.

"They understand that there is no genuine social, political, economic or cultural reform as long as the militarists and their corporatist allies in the war industry continue to loot and pillage the state budget, leaving the poor to go hungry, workingmen and -women in distress, the infrastructure to collapse and social services to be slashed in the name of austerity.

"The psychosis of permanent war, which infected the body politic after World War I with the internal and external war on communism, and which today has mutated into the war on terror, is used by the state to strip us of civil liberties, redirect our resources to the war machine and criminalize democratic dissent.

"We have squandered trillions of dollars and resources in endless and futile wars, from Vietnam to the Middle East, at a time of ecological and fiscal crisis. The folly of endless war is one of the signs of a dying civilization.

"One F-22 Raptor fighter plane costs $350 million. We have 187 of them.

"One Tomahawk cruise missile costs $1.41 million. We fired 161 of them when we attacked Libya.

"This missile attack on Libya alone cost us a quarter of a billion dollars.

"We spend an estimated $1.7 trillion a year on war, far more than the official 54 percent of discretionary spending, or roughly $600 billion.

"If we don’t break the back of the war machine, profound change will be impossible."

And the US homeland will reap the whirlwind it's sown across the Middle East.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
 
Chris Hedges gave the following speech in Orange County, California yesterday (Sunday, 20 September).
"We live in a revolutionary moment. The disastrous economic and political experiment that attempted to organize human behavior around the dictates of the global marketplace has failed..."

"We will, as Friedrich Engels wrote, make a transition to either socialism or barbarism. If we do not dismantle global capitalism we will descend into the Hobbesian chaos of failed states, mass migrations—which we are already witnessing—and endless war..."

Hedges then explains how all socialists oppose "the psychosis of permanent war":
"First and foremost, all socialists are unequivocal anti-militarists and anti-imperialists.

"They understand that there is no genuine social, political, economic or cultural reform as long as the militarists and their corporatist allies in the war industry continue to loot and pillage the state budget, leaving the poor to go hungry, workingmen and -women in distress, the infrastructure to collapse and social services to be slashed in the name of austerity.

"The psychosis of permanent war, which infected the body politic after World War I with the internal and external war on communism, and which today has mutated into the war on terror, is used by the state to strip us of civil liberties, redirect our resources to the war machine and criminalize democratic dissent.

"We have squandered trillions of dollars and resources in endless and futile wars, from Vietnam to the Middle East, at a time of ecological and fiscal crisis. The folly of endless war is one of the signs of a dying civilization.

"One F-22 Raptor fighter plane costs $350 million. We have 187 of them.

"One Tomahawk cruise missile costs $1.41 million. We fired 161 of them when we attacked Libya.

"This missile attack on Libya alone cost us a quarter of a billion dollars.

"We spend an estimated $1.7 trillion a year on war, far more than the official 54 percent of discretionary spending, or roughly $600 billion.

"If we don’t break the back of the war machine, profound change will be impossible."

And the US homeland will reap the whirlwind it's sown across the Middle East.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
To be a socialist is to be pointlessly impoverished.
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
So tell us ...

1. Are you willing to give up everything you own? Aka what is known as private property?

2. How do you propose to turn over all income producing entities to and government which cannot produce an income?

3. How do you propose to keep this country together when the debt is greatest in the world and there wont be an income stream...tax revenue to pay the debt?

4. How do we get income equality when the government runs businesses? ...as there cannot profit which means there cannot be growth..to pay people equally?

5. who will be the leader?

6. And will this leader live the same lifestyle as you will?
 
I think George Orwell refuted this many decades ago . . .

Orwell never met Dubya:
"On the global front, the US has never been more isolated from allies and more hated by opponents. Domestically, there have been serious attacks on civil liberties and the democratic and constitutional order in the US.

"The consequences of the Bush administration’s failed Terror War policies and domestic policy outrages are frightening.1

"The Bush regime seems to be erecting an Orwellian totalitarian state apparatus and plunging the world into ongoing war that could generate a military and police state both domestically and abroad.

"In his prophetic novel 1984, George Orwell envisaged a grim condition of total warfare in which his fictional state Oceania ruled its fearful and intimidated citizens through war, police state terror, surveillance, and the suppression of civil liberties.

"This constant warfare kept Oceania’s citizens in a perpetual situation of mobilization and submission. Further, the Orwellian state controlled language, thought, and behavior through domination of the media, and was thereby able to change the very meaning of language (“war is peace”) and to constantly re-write history itself.2

"Orwell’s futuristic novel was, of course, an attack on the Soviet Union and therefore became a favorite of conservatives over the years, but it uncannily describes the horrors and dangers of the regime of George W. Bush."

https://pages.gseis.ucla.edu/faculty/kellner/essays/orwelliannightmare.pdf
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
Here is a list of successful Socialist states...tell us why these States are socialist and successful:














Yep it's a long list!
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
Orwell never met Dubya:
"On the global front, the US has never been more isolated from allies and more hated by opponents. Domestically, there have been serious attacks on civil liberties and the democratic and constitutional order in the US.

"The consequences of the Bush administration’s failed Terror War policies and domestic policy outrages are frightening.1

"The Bush regime seems to be erecting an Orwellian totalitarian state apparatus and plunging the world into ongoing war that could generate a military and police state both domestically and abroad.

"In his prophetic novel 1984, George Orwell envisaged a grim condition of total warfare in which his fictional state Oceania ruled its fearful and intimidated citizens through war, police state terror, surveillance, and the suppression of civil liberties.

"This constant warfare kept Oceania’s citizens in a perpetual situation of mobilization and submission. Further, the Orwellian state controlled language, thought, and behavior through domination of the media, and was thereby able to change the very meaning of language (“war is peace”) and to constantly re-write history itself.2

"Orwell’s futuristic novel was, of course, an attack on the Soviet Union and therefore became a favorite of conservatives over the years, but it uncannily describes the horrors and dangers of the regime of George W. Bush."

https://pages.gseis.ucla.edu/faculty/kellner/essays/orwelliannightmare.pdf
ok Buddy take the tin foil hat off....so explain if the regime of Bush was Orwellian...why didn't Obama repeal any of the Bush policies?...and why did a declared socialist country like the Soviet S.S.R. Fail?
 
To be a socialist is to be pointlessly impoverished.
Have you noticed the connection between pointless war and poverty?
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920

"We have been at war almost continuously since the first Gulf War in 1991, followed by Somalia in 1992, Haiti in 1994, Bosnia in 1995, Serbia-Kosovo in 1999, Afghanistan in 2001, where we have now been fighting for 14 years, and Iraq in 2003. And we can toss in Yemen, Libya, Pakistan and Syria, along with Israel’s proxy war against the Palestinian people.

"The human cost has been horrendous.

"Over 1 million dead in Iraq.

"Millions more are displaced or are refugees.

"Iraq will never be reconstituted as a unified state. And it was our war industry that created the mess.

"We attacked a country that did not threaten us, and had no intention of threatening its neighbors, and destroyed one of the most modern infrastructures in the Middle East.

"We brought not only terror and death—including the Shiite death squads we armed and trained—but power outages, food shortages and the collapse of basic services, from garbage collection to sewer and water treatment.

"We dismantled Iraq’s institutions, disbanded its security forces, threw its health service into crisis and engineered massive poverty and unemployment.

"And out of the chaos rose insurgents, gangsters, kidnapping rings, jihadists and rogue paramilitary groups—including our hired mercenaries, like [the current army of] Iraq."
 
Here is a list of successful Socialist states...tell us why these States are socialist and successful:














Yep it's a long list!
Can you provide your definition of "socialism?"
Here's a partial explanation of mine:

"You cannot be a socialist and an imperialist. You cannot, as Bernie Sanders has done, support the Obama administration’s wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Pakistan, Somalia and Yemen and be a socialist.

"You cannot, as Sanders has done, vote for every military appropriations bill, including every bill and resolution that empowers and sanctions Israel to carry out its slow-motion genocide of the Palestinian people, and be a socialist.

"And you cannot laud, as Sanders has done, military contractors because they bring jobs to your state. Sanders may have the rhetoric of inequality down, but he is a full-fledged member of the Democratic Caucus, which kneels before the war industry and their lobbyists. And no genuine grass-roots movement will ever be born within the bowels of the Democratic Party establishment, which is currently attempting to shut down Sanders to make sure its anointed candidate is the nominee.

"No elected official dares to challenge any weapons system, no matter how costly or redundant. And Sanders, who votes with the Democrats 98 percent of the time, steers clear of confronting the master of war."
http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
Can you provide your definition of "socialism?"
Here's a partial explanation of mine:

"You cannot be a socialist and an imperialist. You cannot, as Bernie Sanders has done, support the Obama administration’s wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Pakistan, Somalia and Yemen and be a socialist.

"You cannot, as Sanders has done, vote for every military appropriations bill, including every bill and resolution that empowers and sanctions Israel to carry out its slow-motion genocide of the Palestinian people, and be a socialist.

"And you cannot laud, as Sanders has done, military contractors because they bring jobs to your state. Sanders may have the rhetoric of inequality down, but he is a full-fledged member of the Democratic Caucus, which kneels before the war industry and their lobbyists. And no genuine grass-roots movement will ever be born within the bowels of the Democratic Party establishment, which is currently attempting to shut down Sanders to make sure its anointed candidate is the nominee.

"No elected official dares to challenge any weapons system, no matter how costly or redundant. And Sanders, who votes with the Democrats 98 percent of the time, steers clear of confronting the master of war."
http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
So your Chris hedges? otherwise you have adopted someone else's idea of socialism...but hey isn't that the whole premise of socialism...is that you are too stupid to be left to your own ideas and ideals..and that some one else needs to tell you what to think and believe?

btw:

So tell us ...
1. Are you willing to give up everything you own? Aka what is known as private property?
2. How do you propose to turn over all income producing entities to and government which cannot produce an income?
3. How do you propose to keep this country together when the debt is greatest in the world and there wont be an income stream...tax revenue to pay the debt?
4. How do we get income equality when the government runs businesses? ...as there cannot profit which means there cannot be growth..to pay people equally?
5. who will be the leader?
6. And will this leader live the same lifestyle as you will?
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
So tell us ...

1. Are you willing to give up everything you own? Aka what is known as private property?

2. How do you propose to turn over all income producing entities to and government which cannot produce an income?

3. How do you propose to keep this country together when the debt is greatest in the world and there wont be an income stream...tax revenue to pay the debt?

4. How do we get income equality when the government runs businesses? ...as there cannot profit which means there cannot be growth..to pay people equally?

5. who will be the leader?

6. And will this leader live the same lifestyle as you will?
All I can gather from these questions is that you have no idea of what it means to be a socialist.
"Foreign battlefields are laboratories for the architects of industrial slaughter.

"They perfect the tools of control and annihilation on the demonized and the destitute.

"But these tools eventually make their way back to the heart of empire..."

"The tyranny empire imposes on others, as Thucydides reminded us, it finally imposes on itself.

"Those who kill in our name abroad soon kill in our name at home.

"Democracy is snuffed out.

"As the German socialist Karl Liebknechtsaid during the First World War: 'The main enemy is at home.' We will destroy the engines of endless war and shut down the war profiteers or we will become the next victims; indeed many in our marginal communities already are its victims.'"
http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
 
ok Buddy take the tin foil hat off....so explain if the regime of Bush was Orwellian...why didn't Obama repeal any of the Bush policies?...and why did a declared socialist country like the Soviet S.S.R. Fail?
Because the economy of the USSR was more like state/crony capitalism than socialism, and Bush and Obama serve the same 1% of US voters, namely those who profit from eternal debt and endless wars.
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*


socialist...killed over 40 million of his own citizens



Killed 6 million Jewish people



Stalin purged 20 million of his own people


So tell George Phillip who is your favorite?
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
Because the economy of the USSR was more like state/crony capitalism than socialism, and Bush and Obama serve the same 1% of US voters, namely those who profit from eternal debt and endless wars.
So you are saying Obama is Bush II...no news there...You just choose the wrong solution.
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
All I can gather from these questions is that you have no idea of what it means to be a socialist.
"Foreign battlefields are laboratories for the architects of industrial slaughter.

"They perfect the tools of control and annihilation on the demonized and the destitute.

"But these tools eventually make their way back to the heart of empire..."

"The tyranny empire imposes on others, as Thucydides reminded us, it finally imposes on itself.

"Those who kill in our name abroad soon kill in our name at home.

"Democracy is snuffed out.

"As the German socialist Karl Liebknechtsaid during the First World War: 'The main enemy is at home.' We will destroy the engines of endless war and shut down the war profiteers or we will become the next victims; indeed many in our marginal communities already are its victims.'"
http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920

yes but what do you say...or do you have an opinion that is yours? or are you even allowed an opinion?
 

Drumcollie

* See DC's list of Kook posters*
All I can gather from these questions is that you have no idea of what it means to be a socialist.
"Foreign battlefields are laboratories for the architects of industrial slaughter.

"They perfect the tools of control and annihilation on the demonized and the destitute.

"But these tools eventually make their way back to the heart of empire..."

"The tyranny empire imposes on others, as Thucydides reminded us, it finally imposes on itself.

"Those who kill in our name abroad soon kill in our name at home.

"Democracy is snuffed out.

"As the German socialist Karl Liebknechtsaid during the First World War: 'The main enemy is at home.' We will destroy the engines of endless war and shut down the war profiteers or we will become the next victims; indeed many in our marginal communities already are its victims.'"
http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
neither do you know what it is to be a socialist...because you keep quoting others...you sir are a phony socialist...You love other people's ideals in your own mind they seem euphoric and the reality is something you have never experienced...and wont match up to your tin foil hate ideals.
 
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