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the simple reason why we are facing another collapse

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
Then we have a total collapse of society. There would be no distribution of goods, not even toilet paper. Wood and paper pulp would not make it to factory...to make toilet paper.

You, of course, state that toilet paper will be among the most valuable resources on the planet. But...it has a limited use policy that ensures the supply soon runs out...and you blew all that gold for a little comfort.
If such a collapse happened, that is correct.

Yes, the supply would eventually run out if manufacturing was not restored. What is your point?
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
You can't discern the point?
Yes; you're pugnacious. There is no other point to your argument. You probably don't believe in the economic collapse of the US. You don't agree with Days, George or others on the coming doom. You aren't posting for or against the prediction of economic collapse nor the wisdom of planning for a foreseen disaster. Your only point here is to argue with me.
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
Yes; you're pugnacious. There is no other point to your argument. You probably don't believe in the economic collapse of the US. You don't agree with Days, George or others on the coming doom. You aren't posting for or against the prediction of economic collapse nor the wisdom of planning for a foreseen disaster. Your only point here is to argue with me.
Very good.

You've discerned your reason for being on the forum. To argue...and to whine. Good lord do you whine. In this case...you're whining about what another person is...or is not doing regarding hoarding toilet paper...which you claim will be more valuable than gold.

Really...try not to take yourself so seriously...
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
Very good.

You've discerned your reason for being on the forum. To argue...and to whine. Good lord do you whine. In this case...you're whining about what another person is...or is not doing regarding hoarding toilet paper...which you claim will be more valuable than gold.

Really...try not to take yourself so seriously...
Thanks for the admission I was correct.

If you weren't falling all over yourself to argue with me, and me alone (thanks for that tacit admiration), you'd have noticed I'm not stocking up on TP, canned goods or guns for the "coming collapse". My stocks are for just a few weeks at a time.
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
Thanks for the admission I was correct.

If you weren't falling all over yourself to argue with me, and me alone (thanks for that tacit admiration), you'd have noticed I'm not stocking up on TP, canned goods or guns for the "coming collapse". My stocks are for just a few weeks at a time.
The admission is that you are here to argue...and, of course, to whine. I fully admit that. I argue with others, ask Lukey...it's just that your output is voluminous, as you weigh in on nearly every thread, even when you have absolutely nothing to add.

The more you post, the more you open yourself to other posters.
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
The admission is that you are here to argue...and, of course, to whine. I fully admit that. I argue with others, ask Lukey...it's just that your output is voluminous, as you weigh in on nearly every thread, even when you have absolutely nothing to add.

The more you post, the more you open yourself to other posters.
Disagreed on both points; both the assertion that I am here, like you, to "argue" and your personal attack that I'm whining.

While I'll readily agree you follow others around the forum to argue with them, at the moment you seem obsessed with me. That fact fascinates me. Understanding differences in psychology is one of the things that draws me to forums as I've stated several times....in contrast to your false assertion that I (or others for that matter) only come here to argue. That's just classic projection.
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
Disagreed on both points; both the assertion that I am here, like you, to "argue" and your personal attack that I'm whining.

While I'll readily agree you follow others around the forum to argue with them, at the moment you seem obsessed with me. That fact fascinates me. Understanding differences in psychology is one of the things that draws me to forums as I've stated several times....in contrast to your false assertion that I (or others for that matter) only come here to argue. That's just classic projection.
There you go again...trying to psychoanalyze me....while you seem entirely oblivious to the fact that we all are free to do the same with you...as you dodge, lie, argue, and engage in a constant barrage of personal attack...usually in the passive aggressive style....and with just a few posters.

What you see...is...once again...the result of the fact that you have taken the the role as lead poster. Your output opens you to response. It isn't difficult to see that you're seen as a whiner by quite a few of us here.

Hell...I marked one of your posts disagree, because I disagreed with it...and you immediately whined about it.
 
Actually, it's you who backpedaled away from economic collapse to a depression. Believe as you wish, but what you are predicting can't happen without unlimited resources. As long as resources are less than the population needing them, there will be competition, sometimes violent, for those resources.
Actually, I never predicted economic collapse.
But you already knew that.
http://www.cog.brown.edu/courses/cg45/lecture slides/Gricean Maxims.pdf

"The Cooperative Principle..."

"Maxims of Quality: Be truthful. 1. 'Don’t say what you believe to be false.' 2. 'Don’t say what you lack adequate evidence for.'”
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
Yes...such is your obsession with me...that you believe you're psychoanalyzing me.
Dude, I psychoanalyze everyone. It's part of my job. I just don't always post my thoughts or conclusions on the matter.

One reason to post a thought or conclusion is akin to military probing fire; to judge a reaction. If there is no reaction, it doesn't mean I'm wrong, but it also doesn't confirm I'm right. If there is a reaction, then depending on the reaction, it can either affirm or nullify my thoughts/conclusions on the issue.
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
Dude, I psychoanalyze everyone. It's part of my job. I just don't always post my thoughts or conclusions on the matter.

One reason to post a thought or conclusion is akin to military probing fire; to judge a reaction. If there is no reaction, it doesn't mean I'm wrong, but it also doesn't confirm I'm right. If there is a reaction, then depending on the reaction, it can either affirm or nullify my thoughts/conclusions on the issue.
This isn't your job.
 
LOL. And that food and water will just magically appear because you have so much confidence in our government?
This 8 acre fourteen foot deep body of water is within a block of my apartment:

Possibly, I should invest in water purification technology?
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
You are sorry.
You can run, but you can't hide from your own posts. You've repeatedly posted how Socialism is superior and that capitalism will fail.

Have you heard the expression "whistling past the grave yard?" Those adherents of capitalism who haven't noticed its inherent instability, as proven over the last two hundred years, seem to believe capitalism is a natural law, like gravity, for example.

It's not.

It is merely the latest in long line of economic systems dating roughly from the development of fire. Marx called this initial stage "primitive communism" which came to its end with the development of private property. This coincided with large scale agriculture which generated productive property like cattle and, of course, human slaves.

The second stage, according to Marx, was a slave society and this is where the concept of "class" and "state" arise; the former consisted of slave-owners and slaves, and the second develops as a tool for slave owners to more easily control their "property."

Feudalism come third in this progression after greed collapses the slave society. Theocracy, hereditary elites and classes, and the formation of the modern nation state all rise due to their inherent bonds with the Money Power.

Capitalism replaced the feudal serfs with wage labor in much the same way the serf replaced the slave during this fourth stage of development. Market economies and laissez faire economics generated vast, private fortunes by corrupting government to socialize cost and poverty among the majority while privatizing profit for a tiny minority.

Socialism comes fifth after the greed of the few results in producing a working class consciousness in the majority. For the first time in history productive forces are free to develop in a democratically planned way without the vast waste of capitalist anarchy.

Communism comes last, and it never exists until socialism and capitalism have run their historical course.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marx's_theory_of_history#The_stages_of_history

"Fiat money and credit whose values were determined by anarchic market forces are abolished.

"Instead, in his Critique of the Gotha programme, Marx speculated schematically that from the 'total social product' there would be deductions for the requirements of production and 'the common satisfaction of needs, such as schools, health services, etc' which latter deduction 'grows in proportion as the new society develops', and, of course, deductions 'for those unable to work, etc'.

"After these deductions the workers could divide up the wealth produced by their labor and everyone could be simply given a 'certificate from society', which could then be exchanged for products.


"This schematically introduces a means of exchange ('the same principle' i.e. money) in socialist society but with the speculative element removed."
https://berniesanders.com/medicare-for-all/
"SIGN IF YOU AGREE

“'The United States is the only major nation in the industrialized world that does not guarantee health care as a right to its people,' Sanders said. 'Meanwhile, we spend far more per capita on health care with worse results than other countries. It is time that we bring about a fundamental transformation of the American health care system.'”

Since socialism is a transitory phase between capitalism and communism, it has never failed because it has never been attempted in appropriate circumstances.
"For Marxists, socialism or, as Marx termed it, the first phase of communist society, can be viewed as a transitional stage characterized by common or state ownership of the means of production under democratic workers' control and management, which Engels argued was beginning to be realised in the Paris Commune of 1871, before it was overthrown.[35]

"Socialism to them is simply the transitional phase between capitalism and 'higher phase of communist society'. Because this society has characteristics of both its capitalist ancestor and is beginning to show the properties of communism, it will hold the means of production collectively but distributes commodities according to individual contribution."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_socialism#Marxism_and_the_socialist_movement
All I can gather from these questions is that you have no idea of what it means to be a socialist.
"Foreign battlefields are laboratories for the architects of industrial slaughter.

"They perfect the tools of control and annihilation on the demonized and the destitute.

"But these tools eventually make their way back to the heart of empire..."

"The tyranny empire imposes on others, as Thucydides reminded us, it finally imposes on itself.

"Those who kill in our name abroad soon kill in our name at home.

"Democracy is snuffed out.

"As the German socialist Karl Liebknechtsaid during the First World War: 'The main enemy is at home.' We will destroy the engines of endless war and shut down the war profiteers or we will become the next victims; indeed many in our marginal communities already are its victims.'"
http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/what_it_means_to_be_a_socialist_20150920
An economic system that generates wealth as efficiently as capitalism does is guaranteed to produce oligarchs who will then use their private fortunes to dominate government through time honored deceits of divide and conquer. Isn't the rational choice here between exterminating private fortunes or democratic government?
 

Wahbooz

Governor
There's a big difference between real money that has intrinsic value and synthetic money that has no intrinsic value. Real money is wealth. Synthetic money is not wealth, it merely distributes the wealth. If you mint a bunch of gold coins, you have added to the wealth of the nation, while if you print a bunch of paper notes, you have added no wealth, just thinned the currency value. What the banks have done is print so much currency for themselves, that they own more currency than any market is worth, that way they can control how much currency is in each market by adding or taking away credit to each market. There is over a quadrillion dollars "in print" but most of it sits in asset reserve and isn't traded. The whole game is control. They can slap those cards up and fold them at breakneck speeds, and while it may cause us distress and hard times, it really doesn't affect them. In the final analysis, synthetic money is a control mechanism.
First of all, Days, the mints do not print paper money, that is under the control of BEP, Bureau of Engraving and Printing. Secondly, where do you get this 'quadrillion' from? The total amount of cash/coin, plus demand deposits, travelers checks, and other checkable deposits, comes to just over $2 trillion. This idea that the treasury keeps printing paper, and throwing it into the economy is untrue. Yes, BEP has currency printed, to replace worn out notes.

As for worthless money, the U.S. is the largest owner of gold, with over 8,133 tonnes of gold in reserve. I wouldn't believe everything you read.
 
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