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Brexit update.

EatTheRich

President
It is sometimes hard to judge our politics over the last 46 yrs because so much law making has come out of Brussels - but even during those years, as well as before, Labour have always left us bankrupt - Blair and Brown were incredibly irresponsible - they left a note on the incoming Tory Treasurers desk saying 'I am afraid there is no money'. It means that the Tories are always blamed for being harsh, I do not always disagree with that, when trying to pull us out of the mess Labour's public overspending leaves behind BUT we are now in a much better economic state after the 10 miserable years of Cameron and May. I know that you probably sympathize with Corbyn but honestly how would he pay for his open door immigration, four working day week and so on? He intends to tax us up to the hilt, including our gardens, and we know from the Wilson years that means that people who could generate any wealth just leave the country in their droves.

I like Boris and he is fun, which is a huge bonus in this day and age, he is a moderate and not an unkindly man who does love Britain - and do not forget that underpinning life here is the welfare state, which will be a lot healthier out of the EU's strangulating clutches.
My issues with Corbyn are his anti-Semitism, opposition to Brexit, arrogant technocratic attitude, and lack of a genuine labor base. Labour needs to be brought to heel by the unions or replaced with a true labor party. But voting Conservative means jumping from the frying pan into the fire.
 

EatTheRich

President
I beg to differ, Ma'am. The Tories supported the crown during the Revolutionary War. And the crown certainly did not respect property rights.
We thank the British for the 4th Amendment (and most of the others in our Bill of Rights) that prevents the entry into people's homes, by police or military, without a warrant.
The Crown was very much on the side of the propertied interests.
 
My issues with Corbyn are his anti-Semitism, opposition to Brexit, arrogant technocratic attitude, and lack of a genuine labor base. Labour needs to be brought to heel by the unions or replaced with a true labor party. But voting Conservative means jumping from the frying pan into the fire.
He is just a silly 17yr old activist in a 70 yr old body or as some else one said ' a 16 year old who forgot to grow up' but some of those around him are very frightening people.

The Unions do run Labour but now are all in the pay of the EU, it is they who are against Brexit. The postal union is threatening to go on strike around the election = not sending postal votes in. The Unions were completely ruined by mass immigration - cheap compliant labour and no-one here wants to live through those years of Union power ever again.

The Tories are the only ones who can and will get us out - that's just a fact of life and if Farage would just take his BP cultists back to Europe with him Boris would win by a landslide - even in many of the old Labour strongholds.
 

FakeName

Governor
He is just a silly 17yr old activist in a 70 yr old body or as some else one said ' a 16 year old who forgot to grow up' but some of those around him are very frightening people.

The Unions do run Labour but now are all in the pay of the EU, it is they who are against Brexit. The postal union is threatening to go on strike around the election = not sending postal votes in. The Unions were completely ruined by mass immigration - cheap compliant labour and no-one here wants to live through those years of Union power ever again.

The Tories are the only ones who can and will get us out - that's just a fact of life and if Farage would just take his BP cultists back to Europe with him Boris would win by a landslide - even in many of the old Labour strongholds.


Boris Johnson accidentally made an incredibly compelling argument against his own Brexit deal
https://amp.businessinsider.com/video-boris-johnson-accidentally-made-a-perfect-argument-against-brexit-2019-11
 
Boris Johnson accidentally made an incredibly compelling argument against his own Brexit deal
https://amp.businessinsider.com/video-boris-johnson-accidentally-made-a-perfect-argument-against-brexit-2019-11
NI are the only ones with a land border - GB doesn't. GB will have the better of the two choices - NI will have that with GB and access to the EU's single market - in four years time NI can chose, themselves, what they want to carry on doing in the future.

Best of all would be that the republic leave the EU too.
 
Of course the Bankers wanted Yeltsin - thereby came their Russian Oligarchs.

I've told you that story before haven't I? All of the states in and around Russia were very concerned about finding a way that they could introduce capitalism into what was a communist system without too much harm being done. There was to be a three day conference --- They did nothing the first day, Yeltsin was too drunk, after dinner even drunker - before breakfast he was too sick - by lunch to drunk and so on and on for the whole conference. The others had to go and said but we have to decide Yeltsin, drunkenly said --- 'just let it happen by itself, it'll be ok' and had another vodka. Everyone left with nothing decided and in came the Bankers via their Oligarchs - causing terrible misery in their wake.

When ever this Greive thing is brought up no-one is interested - not even Remoaners seem to take any notice of it. Now a Labour ex MP, looking for reelection, is saying ' but I'm not a Russian spy, honest' - so I dunno what else has been said about the Greive committee's findings - nor do I care.
When ever this Greive thing is brought up no-one is interested - not even Remoaners seem to take any notice of it. Now a Labour ex MP, looking for reelection, is saying ' but I'm not a Russian spy, honest' - so I dunno what else has been said about the Greive committee's findings - nor do I care.
Is it accurate to say the EU prefers Labour's position, i.e., the closest possible relationship with the EU including the existing customs union and the single market? Countries that can't control the movement of capital find it nearly impossible to control patterns of investment inside their borders, and a "free" movement of capital necessitates a "free" movement of labour. Would you say Johnson's side is looking to cheapen labour in general, thereby turning the UK into the Singapore of the North Sea?
 
Is it accurate to say the EU prefers Labour's position, i.e., the closest possible relationship with the EU including the existing customs union and the single market? Countries that can't control the movement of capital find it nearly impossible to control patterns of investment inside their borders, and a "free" movement of capital necessitates a "free" movement of labour. Would you say Johnson's side is looking to cheapen labour in general, thereby turning the UK into the Singapore of the North Sea?
Is that Labour's position? It does tend to change from one day to the next - many Labour MPs are now leaving the party and telling voters to vote Tory. I do not know what Labour's position is other than they say that; they will negotiate a deal with the EU in 6 mths and then have a referendum ''Remain'' or ''Their 'as yet unknown' Deal'' but campaign for Remain, not the Deal that they will negotiate with the EU.

The LibDems want to revoke Art 50.

No, the Tories are raising the minimum wage up to £10.50 per hr from £8. 21 and with tightened control ,on cheap labour coming in from the Eastern bloc, wages should stay stable - one would think.

George, one is in the EU or one is out of the EU, there is no in between. There is no soft Brexit. Soft Brexit actually means Remain. We are not on the same landmass as most of the rest of the EU so don't need a Norwegian or Swiss type of compromise.
 
Is that Labour's position? It does tend to change from one day to the next - many Labour MPs are now leaving the party and telling voters to vote Tory. I do not know what Labour's position is other than they say that; they will negotiate a deal with the EU in 6 mths and then have a referendum ''Remain'' or ''Their 'as yet unknown' Deal'' but campaign for Remain, not the Deal that they will negotiate with the EU.

The LibDems want to revoke Art 50.

No, the Tories are raising the minimum wage up to £10.50 per hr from £8. 21 and with tightened control ,on cheap labour coming in from the Eastern bloc, wages should stay stable - one would think.

George, one is in the EU or one is out of the EU, there is no in between. There is no soft Brexit. Soft Brexit actually means Remain. We are not on the same landmass as most of the rest of the EU so don't need a Norwegian or Swiss type of compromise.
George, one is in the EU or one is out of the EU, there is no in between. There is no soft Brexit. Soft Brexit actually means Remain. We are not on the same landmass as most of the rest of the EU so don't need a Norwegian or Swiss type of compromise.
Are you expecting to find more in common with Russia after Brexit?

https://www.ft.com/content/2057070e-f961-11e9-98fd-4d6c20050229

"So it is unsurprising that the UK and Russia are likely to end up as the two major European powers that stand outside the EU. However, both countries will continue to worry about the EU’s collective power.

"As nations on the periphery, they have traditionally feared the rise of a single power dominating the European landmass — which partly explains why they ended up as allies in the Napoleonic wars and the two world wars.

"Each country has built its modern identity around the memory of victory in 1945. And both are shaped by nostalgia for imperial power."

https://www.ft.com/content/2057070e-f961-11e9-98fd-4d6c20050229
 
Are you expecting to find more in common with Russia after Brexit?

https://www.ft.com/content/2057070e-f961-11e9-98fd-4d6c20050229

"So it is unsurprising that the UK and Russia are likely to end up as the two major European powers that stand outside the EU. However, both countries will continue to worry about the EU’s collective power.

"As nations on the periphery, they have traditionally feared the rise of a single power dominating the European landmass — which partly explains why they ended up as allies in the Napoleonic wars and the two world wars.

"Each country has built its modern identity around the memory of victory in 1945. And both are shaped by nostalgia for imperial power."

https://www.ft.com/content/2057070e-f961-11e9-98fd-4d6c20050229
I don't know about Russia George. I have never been there and I have known very few Russians.

Brexit has nothing to do with the loss of Empire, on the contrary, it is about escaping from one. Fear the EU from outside it? No -------it is those trapped inside who fear it.

Most of Europe has an imperial memory. Of 1945, yes, I am afraid it is used in argument as an objection to EU rule sometimes --- Is it true that the grandchild give up easily that which their grandparents fought to keep and protect?

But yes Russia and Britain do have things in common and we used to trade before they went Red. It is a natural trading relationship and a sensible one. Will it be rekindled? Dunno
 
I don't know about Russia George. I have never been there and I have known very few Russians.

Brexit has nothing to do with the loss of Empire, on the contrary, it is about escaping from one. Fear the EU from outside it? No -------it is those trapped inside who fear it.

Most of Europe has an imperial memory. Of 1945, yes, I am afraid it is used in argument as an objection to EU rule sometimes --- Is it true that the grandchild give up easily that which their grandparents fought to keep and protect?

But yes Russia and Britain do have things in common and we used to trade before they went Red. It is a natural trading relationship and a sensible one. Will it be rekindled? Dunno
Brexit has nothing to do with the loss of Empire, on the contrary, it is about escaping from one. Fear the EU from outside it? No -------it is those trapped inside who fear it.

Most of Europe has an imperial memory. Of 1945, yes, I am afraid it is used in argument as an objection to EU rule sometimes --- Is it true that the grandchild give up easily that which their grandparents fought to keep and protect?
I didn't bring any children into this world, but I've noticed the economic disadvantages today's young people face that weren't there fifty years ago. Perhaps Brexit and Trump's impending impeachment will send corrupt bankers and governments a message they can't ignore?

"In this Autumn of Discontent, people from Chile, Haiti and Honduras to Iraq, Egypt and Lebanon are rising up against neoliberalism, which has in many cases been imposed on them by U.S. invasions, coups and other brutal uses of force.

"The repression against activists has been savage, with more than 250 protesters killed in Iraq in October alone, but the protests have continued and grown.

"Some movements, such as in Algeria and Sudan, have already forced the downfall of long-entrenched, corrupt governments."

https://www.counterpunch.org/2019/11/08/neoliberalisms-children-rise-up-to-demand-justice-in-chile-and-the-world/
 
I didn't bring any children into this world, but I've noticed the economic disadvantages today's young people face that weren't there fifty years ago. Perhaps Brexit and Trump's impending impeachment will send corrupt bankers and governments a message they can't ignore?

"In this Autumn of Discontent, people from Chile, Haiti and Honduras to Iraq, Egypt and Lebanon are rising up against neoliberalism, which has in many cases been imposed on them by U.S. invasions, coups and other brutal uses of force.

"The repression against activists has been savage, with more than 250 protesters killed in Iraq in October alone, but the protests have continued and grown.

"Some movements, such as in Algeria and Sudan, have already forced the downfall of long-entrenched, corrupt governments."

https://www.counterpunch.org/2019/11/08/neoliberalisms-children-rise-up-to-demand-justice-in-chile-and-the-world/
I think that there is worse to come - unnecessarily.

Boris isn't in yet George - but if he gets his majority -what can any of our Leaders actually do? We know what happens if they cross the wrong people or the wrong line but .............. mmm they might shift things a little and that little might be enough if we make use of it. I am sure that Boris would, if he gets a decent majority, get us out of the EU - but it stops there - of any other changes for the betterment - I dunno.
 
I think that there is worse to come - unnecessarily.

Boris isn't in yet George - but if he gets his majority -what can any of our Leaders actually do? We know what happens if they cross the wrong people or the wrong line but .............. mmm they might shift things a little and that little might be enough if we make use of it. I am sure that Boris would, if he gets a decent majority, get us out of the EU - but it stops there - of any other changes for the betterment - I dunno.
Boris isn't in yet George - but if he gets his majority -what can any of our Leaders actually do? We know what happens if they cross the wrong people or the wrong line but .............. mmm they might shift things a little and that little might be enough if we make use of it. I am sure that Boris would, if he gets a decent majority, get us out of the EU - but it stops there - of any other changes for the betterment - I dunno
This link is from last August.
How much are you worried about?


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49388402

"According to Operation Yellowhammer, the dossier leaked to the Sunday Times, the UK could face months of disruption at its ports after a no-deal Brexit.

"And plans to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic are unlikely to prove sustainable, it adds.

"The dossier says leaving the EU without a deal could lead to:

  • Fresh food becoming less available and prices rising
  • A hard Irish border after plans to avoid checks fail, sparking protests
  • Fuel becoming less available and 2,000 jobs being lost if the government sets petrol import tariffs to 0%, potentially causing two oil refineries to close
  • UK patients having to wait longer for medicines, including insulin and flu vaccines
  • A rise in public disorder and community tensions resulting from a shortage of food and drugs
  • Passengers being delayed at EU airports, Eurotunnel and Dover
  • Freight disruption at ports lasting up to three months, caused by customs checks, before traffic flow improves to 50-70% of the current rate"
 
This link is from last August.
How much are you worried about?


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49388402

"According to Operation Yellowhammer, the dossier leaked to the Sunday Times, the UK could face months of disruption at its ports after a no-deal Brexit.

"And plans to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic are unlikely to prove sustainable, it adds.

"The dossier says leaving the EU without a deal could lead to:

  • Fresh food becoming less available and prices rising
  • A hard Irish border after plans to avoid checks fail, sparking protests
  • Fuel becoming less available and 2,000 jobs being lost if the government sets petrol import tariffs to 0%, potentially causing two oil refineries to close
  • UK patients having to wait longer for medicines, including insulin and flu vaccines
  • A rise in public disorder and community tensions resulting from a shortage of food and drugs
  • Passengers being delayed at EU airports, Eurotunnel and Dover
  • Freight disruption at ports lasting up to three months, caused by customs checks, before traffic flow improves to 50-70% of the current rate"
That was May's worst case scenario - lol, as you can imagine there was loads of stock-pilling after that report was published.

I am not worried at all.
 
Good news for Boris and the Tories.

https://news.sky.com/story/general-election-nigel-farages-brexit-party-wont-contest-any-seats-won-by-tories-in-2017-11859370

General election: Nigel Farage's Brexit Party won't contest seats won by Tories in 2017
Nigel Farage's party had previously announced candidates in 600 seats across the UK, but this will now be below 300.
God that bloody man!

He is still contesting seats which the Tories could/would win back - thus the vote will be split and Lab or LibDem will get it.

There are Labour seats where Tories have no chance, he should concentrate on them alone but no, old big head has to stay relevant.

The BP is only a Ltd company - there are no members - just subscribers - poor fools.
 
Lastest

Boris refuses to apologize for calling Corbyn a wan'ker lol

Sillier and sillier

''Boris Johnson will today launch a scathing attack on Jeremy Corbyn by suggesting a Labour government would result in more 'masturbation' over Brexit .

The Prime Minister will finally today break his cover on the election trail after only holding limited photo opportunities recently..........''


https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/general-election-2019-boris-johnsons-20871503

As if it doesn't make people love him more ;) well, except for those 2 adults and 2 million children who still love Corbyn.
 
Lastest

Boris refuses to apologize for calling Corbyn a wan'ker lol

Sillier and sillier

''Boris Johnson will today launch a scathing attack on Jeremy Corbyn by suggesting a Labour government would result in more 'masturbation' over Brexit .

The Prime Minister will finally today break his cover on the election trail after only holding limited photo opportunities recently..........''


https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/general-election-2019-boris-johnsons-20871503

As if it doesn't make people love him more ;) well, except for those 2 adults and 2 million children who still love Corbyn.
Are Tories worried about a democratic determination to your Brexit dilemma?

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-quietly-vote-through-change-20786946

"Tory MPs last night voted through a quiet change to the system that Labour warns could 'gerrymander' future elections.

"In future, councils will no longer need to send an 'annual canvass' form by post to all households each year to check who is on the electoral roll.

"Instead they will be allowed to take a light-touch approach that focuses on homes most likely to have seen a change, and also uses methods like e-mails and phone calls.

"The move, which is expected to save £171m over 10 years, was voted through the House of Commons 206-33 last night with no debate thanks to the backing of Conservative MPs."
 
Are Tories worried about a democratic determination to your Brexit dilemma?

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-quietly-vote-through-change-20786946

"Tory MPs last night voted through a quiet change to the system that Labour warns could 'gerrymander' future elections.

"In future, councils will no longer need to send an 'annual canvass' form by post to all households each year to check who is on the electoral roll.

"Instead they will be allowed to take a light-touch approach that focuses on homes most likely to have seen a change, and also uses methods like e-mails and phone calls.

"The move, which is expected to save £171m over 10 years, was voted through the House of Commons 206-33 last night with no debate thanks to the backing of Conservative MPs."
Two weeks ago - I didn't see that but I've been wondering what was happening on that front.
Cameron said in 2011 that this census, 2011, was our last one. That there will never be anther one.

Worrying isn't it?

I don't though understand your question. Oh ok, I've woken up now .... I suspect that the council one is more about being up to date, as in, using e mails instead of paper mail. I don't like it but that is the way of things now --- up until now it was illegal not to fill in the council forms - will that change?
Or and it isn't so much about democracy as demography - 'They' do not want us to realise the extent of mass immigration.
 
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Two weeks ago - I didn't see that but I've been wondering what was happening on that front.
Cameron said in 2011 that this census, 2011, was our last one. That there will never be anther one.

Worrying isn't it?

I don't though understand your question. Oh ok, I've woken up now .... I suspect that the council one is more about being up to date, as in, using e mails instead of paper mail. I don't like it but that is the way of things now --- up until now it was illegal not to fill in the council forms - will that change?
Or and it isn't so much about democracy as demography - 'They' do not want us to realise the extent of mass immigration.
I don't like it but that is the way of things now --- up until now it was illegal not to fill in the council forms - will that change?
Or and it isn't so much about democracy as demography - 'They' do not want us to realise the extent of mass immigration.
Is this an accurate depiction of your current racial demographics?

https://www.economicmodelling.co.uk/2014/02/24/highlights-of-our-2014-data-update-part-1-demographics/

By some accounts US whites will achieve minority status by mid-century.

Are there similar concerns in the UK?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_multiculturalism#New_Labour_and_multiculturalism

"Renewed controversy on the subject came to the fore when Andrew Neather—a former adviser to Jack Straw, Tony Blair and David Blunkett—said that Labour ministers had a hidden agenda in allowing mass immigration into Britain, to 'change the face of Britain forever'.

"This alleged conspiracy has become known by the sobriquet 'Neathergate'.

According to Neather, who was present at closed meetings in 2000, a secret Government report called for mass immigration to change Britain's cultural make-up, and that 'mass immigration was the way that the government was going to make the UK truly multicultural'.

"Neather went on to say that 'the policy was intended—even if this wasn't its main purpose — to rub the right's nose in diversity and render their arguments out of date'"
 
Is this an accurate depiction of your current racial demographics?

https://www.economicmodelling.co.uk/2014/02/24/highlights-of-our-2014-data-update-part-1-demographics/

By some accounts US whites will achieve minority status by mid-century.

Are there similar concerns in the UK?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_multiculturalism#New_Labour_and_multiculturalism

"Renewed controversy on the subject came to the fore when Andrew Neather—a former adviser to Jack Straw, Tony Blair and David Blunkett—said that Labour ministers had a hidden agenda in allowing mass immigration into Britain, to 'change the face of Britain forever'.

"This alleged conspiracy has become known by the sobriquet 'Neathergate'.

According to Neather, who was present at closed meetings in 2000, a secret Government report called for mass immigration to change Britain's cultural make-up, and that 'mass immigration was the way that the government was going to make the UK truly multicultural'.

"Neather went on to say that 'the policy was intended—even if this wasn't its main purpose — to rub the right's nose in diversity and render their arguments out of date'"
From the 1950s-60 when there just a handful of people descended from Africa , Asia and ME and so on, in all of our cities now, not only are the British a minority but white people as a whole are. Yes, in 25-30 years the indigenous people here will be the hated minority if something isn't done..

Oh God yes it escalated in their time - God they were evil Scottish sh'its Blair and Brown -


BTW Boris is going after Soros - we are being told.
 
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