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Republicanism & The Electoral College

Some rights were earned in struggle (political or intellectual) by our ancestors and are the common heritage of all humanity. They are what make us fit to call ourselves human.
No Self-Determination for Those Determined to Destroy Us

Humanity is an imaginary concept. Many people have little in common with others. Many are enemies of mankind. Allowing destructive or useless types the same rights as others endangers the fit.
 
Madison and Hamilton were giants, intellectual giants and both of them were critical to our founding. Paine is in that group as well. Let us respect them for who they were but remember that the times in which they lived are gone and gone forever. The concept of a republic was founded upon the realities of the times as well. The people were generally illiterate, they were landless and mostly very poor. The colonies were very unique, each one a different culture in many ways and many of them were founded upon religious foundations that made each colony a semi-nation in and of itself. There were only 13 of them and the number of people living in the first 13 colonies was less than a few million give or take a couple million slaves. Madison and Hamilton created a system that worked for that era, they had no clue that one day we would have 330 million people, 50 states and that we would become the worlds greatest economic and military power.

Given this truth, is it really a good idea to give a Senator from Alaska representing a hundred thousand voters the exact same power as a Senator from California representing 5-8 million voters? Does it make sense to continue the Electoral College system in an era where one or two states end up picking a POTUS despite the popular vote count? Does it make sense to only have 435 House members representing 700,000 people each or doubling the number of seats to make the House more representative and allow for third parties? Is the Senate obsolete? Is the 2nd amendment obsolete? Does the 9th amendment mean anything at all? What exactly does the 10th amendment mean? Should we make it easier to amend the constitution? All these things should be on the table and discussed by rational, reasoned minds. But instead of the collective brilliance of the original 55 who were all extremely well educated and rational, we discuss these matters in the media with pundits who could not hold a candle to any of the 55.

Remember that when you review what they thought 130 years ago.
 
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EatTheRich

President
Given this truth, is it really a good idea to give a Senator from Alaska representing a hundred thousand voters the exact same power as a Senator from California representing 5-8 million voters?
No.

Does it make sense to continue the Electoral College system in an era where one or two states end up picking a POTUS despite the popular vote count?
No.

Does it make sense to only have 435 House members representing 700,000 people each or doubling the number of seats to make the House more representative and allow for third parties?
Doubling the number of seats sounds like a reasonable proposition. The devil's in the details, of course, particularly how it specifically affects the political balance of power.

Is the Senate obsolete?
Yes.

Is the 2nd amendment obsolete?
Certainly not.

Does the 9th amendment mean anything at all?
It means that the courts can't arbitrarily deprive us of rights that ought to be ours because they aren't specifically enumerated in the constitution. One of the rights that we have successfully asserted (in political struggle) against efforts to deprive us of it on those grounds is the right to privacy, which is the basis for Roe v. Wade among other important legal victories.

What exactly does the 10th amendment mean?
Most of the part pertaining to the powers of the states was superseded by the 14th Amendment. However, it reiterates that the Constitution limits the power of the federal government, and prohibits the exercise of powers not granted to it, and notes that those powers can legitimately be exercised either by the states or by the people.

Should we make it easier to amend the constitution?
Again a case of "devil in the details." Easier for whom? Congress, state legislatures, citizen initiative, a new constitutional convention?
 

EatTheRich

President
Communism Is Monopoly Capitalism

No, I'll let you decide for me since you're the vanguard of history.
Well, at the risk of sounding like a would-be totalitarian censor, I'd say that politically speaking I don't trust you. Your blend of ultra-egalitarianism, anti-intellectualism, contempt for theory, anti-humanism, and anti-Marxism is reminiscent of Pol Pot.
 
No.


No.



Doubling the number of seats sounds like a reasonable proposition. The devil's in the details, of course, particularly how it specifically affects the political balance of power.



Yes.



Certainly not.



It means that the courts can't arbitrarily deprive us of rights that ought to be ours because they aren't specifically enumerated in the constitution. One of the rights that we have successfully asserted (in political struggle) against efforts to deprive us of it on those grounds is the right to privacy, which is the basis for Roe v. Wade among other important legal victories.



Most of the part pertaining to the powers of the states was superseded by the 14th Amendment. However, it reiterates that the Constitution limits the power of the federal government, and prohibits the exercise of powers not granted to it, and notes that those powers can legitimately be exercised either by the states or by the people.



Again a case of "devil in the details." Easier for whom? Congress, state legislatures, citizen initiative, a new constitutional convention?
I agree with many of your conclusions. I disagree though with the 2nd amendment as it is interpreted today, the Heller decision was wrong. The details are the key to changing the law but if we solve all the problems here among us, what will the experts have to do but screw it all up?
 
Well, at the risk of sounding like a would-be totalitarian censor, I'd say that politically speaking I don't trust you. Your blend of ultra-egalitarianism, anti-intellectualism, contempt for theory, anti-humanism, and anti-Marxism is reminiscent of Pol Pot.
Free Yourself From Your Conceited Guru Tricksters


Egalitarianism? Only in the respect of giving the children of the rich no advantages. As far as value to society goes, people are as unequal in talents as they would be if sports represented the whole of society.

Anti-intellectual? No, I am anti-academic. Anyone who is not self-educated will be brainwashed if he lets professors tell him what to think.

Yes, I do have contempt for theory having precedence over adjusting to things as they play out in reality.

Anti-humanism? Some people are subhuman and enemies of humanity. There's no such thing as doing good for bad people. Turning savages loose on people is anti-human.

Marx was an aristocratic saboteur with an undeserved Born to Rule attitude. Just like you, he had contempt for the workers' views, which were based on experience and not some sheltered theory imagined in an isolated and sheltered escapist hideout like the university. I've read neither Das Kapital nor The Wealth of Nations because they both turned out to be nightmares when applied to real life. It's like finding out before seeing The Sixth Sense that Bruce Willis's character was dead all along.

Pol Pot? Just your own kind of Godwin's Law error.
 

EatTheRich

President
Yes, I do have contempt for theory having precedence over adjusting to things as they play out in reality.
This is healthy. What is not is taking the default positions of pragmatism and empiricism (meaning in practice: accommodation to the status quo) because your anti-theory theoretical background assumptions blind you to the dialectical nature of reality.

Pol Pot? Just your own kind of Godwin's Law error.
I make no compunction about comparing people to Hitler if I think they deserve it. Your own ideology appears more Pol Potist than Hitlerite to me. If you say that "some" (and clearly when you compare the masses to "savages" you mean "most") people are subhuman and deserve to die, you can't be surprised to be compared to some monster or another.
 

EatTheRich

President
Marx was an aristocratic saboteur with an undeserved Born to Rule attitude. Just like you, he had contempt for the workers' views, which were based on experience and not some sheltered theory imagined in an isolated and sheltered escapist hideout like the university.
Marx was recruited to the Communist League, a working-class movement, before becoming a co-founder of the First International. He later joined the workers in fighting efforts by anarchists (i.e., middle-class ideologues) to take over the International. Throughout his political career, he was in intimate contact with the working class, with whom he participated in strikes, demonstrations, and pressure campaigns. He sometimes criticized the workers for being undisciplined, or for being in thrall to bourgeois ideology and therefore conservative, but these criticisms were always made with the aim of strengthening the working class and the political weapon he helped it forge.

I've read neither Das Kapital nor The Wealth of Nations because they both turned out to be nightmares when applied to real life. It's like finding out before seeing The Sixth Sense that Bruce Willis's character was dead all along.
Yet you feel qualified to speak on Marx's views as if you were an expert. What exactly is so nightmarish about the USSR in Lenin's time, or Castro's Cuba? Is Marx responsible for the Stalinist counterrevolutionary counterfeit of communism that was built on the struggle (ideological and political/military) against his views? Isn't that like saying that Napoleon's France was based on Rousseau's Social Contract?
 
Marx was recruited to the Communist League, a working-class movement, before becoming a co-founder of the First International. He later joined the workers in fighting efforts by anarchists (i.e., middle-class ideologues) to take over the International. Throughout his political career, he was in intimate contact with the working class, with whom he participated in strikes, demonstrations, and pressure campaigns. He sometimes criticized the workers for being undisciplined, or for being in thrall to bourgeois ideology and therefore conservative, but these criticisms were always made with the aim of strengthening the working class and the political weapon he helped it forge.



Yet you feel qualified to speak on Marx's views as if you were an expert. What exactly is so nightmarish about the USSR in Lenin's time, or Castro's Cuba? Is Marx responsible for the Stalinist counterrevolutionary counterfeit of communism that was built on the struggle (ideological and political/military) against his views? Isn't that like saying that Napoleon's France was based on Rousseau's Social Contract?
Marx gets sorry treatment from politicians but in fact, he was one of the greatest thinkers of the last 300 years. Was he right in regards to the eventual collapse of capitalism? Sure looks like it to me, his timing was a bit off though. Marx talked about much more than just economics, his work crossed many disciplines. The guy really put it to the emerging model of capitalism as it grew out of mercantilism. Just because Lenin co-opted him is no reason not to consider his writings important. Most PHDs in philosophy consider him one of the most important thinkers of all time, that does not mean they agree with everything he said though. If you know anything about philosophy you will agree that very few philosophers agreed on anything at all, that is why they kept writing and castigating each other down the ages.
 
This is healthy. What is not is taking the default positions of pragmatism and empiricism (meaning in practice: accommodation to the status quo) because your anti-theory theoretical background assumptions blind you to the dialectical nature of reality.



I make no compunction about comparing people to Hitler if I think they deserve it. Your own ideology appears more Pol Potist than Hitlerite to me. If you say that "some" (and clearly when you compare the masses to "savages" you mean "most") people are subhuman and deserve to die, you can't be surprised to be compared to some monster or another.
The God That Failed

Again just like a religious fanatic, you believe that anyone who rejects your pet theory has no theory at all.

Marxists and all followers of both Left and Right wing gurus have a deep born and bred contempt for the majority. Partisan sheep think we are like children who need to be guided and disciplined by the snobs trained in academentia.

That explains all Communist tyranny. No ignorant but endlessly repeated diagnoses like "Power Corrupts" (guillotine-fodder Lord Acton) are necessary. Stunted people being conceited just because their father-figures tell them they are the best and brightest leads to their being proud to create a dictatorship.
 
Marx was recruited to the Communist League, a working-class movement, before becoming a co-founder of the First International. He later joined the workers in fighting efforts by anarchists (i.e., middle-class ideologues) to take over the International. Throughout his political career, he was in intimate contact with the working class, with whom he participated in strikes, demonstrations, and pressure campaigns. He sometimes criticized the workers for being undisciplined, or for being in thrall to bourgeois ideology and therefore conservative, but these criticisms were always made with the aim of strengthening the working class and the political weapon he helped it forge.



Yet you feel qualified to speak on Marx's views as if you were an expert. What exactly is so nightmarish about the USSR in Lenin's time, or Castro's Cuba? Is Marx responsible for the Stalinist counterrevolutionary counterfeit of communism that was built on the struggle (ideological and political/military) against his views? Isn't that like saying that Napoleon's France was based on Rousseau's Social Contract?
Since yours is a permanent student's substitute for religion, the key to Martin Luther's failure to change the world for the better was that he didn't reject his basic creed for leading to the tyranny and corruption of the Catholic Church, just like you foolishly stick with Marx after rejecting his inevitable Stalinist spawn.
 

EatTheRich

President
Marx gets sorry treatment from politicians but in fact, he was one of the greatest thinkers of the last 300 years. Was he right in regards to the eventual collapse of capitalism? Sure looks like it to me, his timing was a bit off though. Marx talked about much more than just economics, his work crossed many disciplines. The guy really put it to the emerging model of capitalism as it grew out of mercantilism. Just because Lenin co-opted him is no reason not to consider his writings important. Most PHDs in philosophy consider him one of the most important thinkers of all time, that does not mean they agree with everything he said though. If you know anything about philosophy you will agree that very few philosophers agreed on anything at all, that is why they kept writing and castigating each other down the ages.
I'd say his influence on Lenin is all the more reason to consider him important.
 

EatTheRich

President
Since yours is a permanent student's substitute for religion, the key to Martin Luther's failure to change the world for the better was that he didn't reject his basic creed for leading to the tyranny and corruption of the Catholic Church, just like you foolishly stick with Marx after rejecting his inevitable Stalinist spawn.
But Luther did change the world for the better, didn't he? And other Christians--Calvin, Muntzer, Wilberforce, King--even more so?

If the "basic creed" of Christianity is the Trinity, the Incarnation, the sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross, etc., Luther can rightly be blamed for clinging to it (if we ignore that he'd have gotten next to nowhere as, say, an atheist or a Muslim). If, however, it is "Love thy neighbor," it has nothing to do with the "tyranny and corruption of the Catholic Church."

Likewise, if the basic idea of Marxism is "abolition of private property"--and it is--that has nothing to do with the Stalinist regimes that took from Marx nothing but some radical phrases.
 
Not at all. I said that you have an anti-theory ideology because you attack the foundations of theoretical analysis ... education and intellectual cognition.
Karl Marx, the Trophy Husband of a Duchess Getting Even With Her Parents

Self-education is far more valid than being a child looking for a father figure, which is the situation at the universities. Once again, your snob Marxism is like saying that only those who studied the Bible at seminaries can tell Christians how to be Christian.
 
I'd say his influence on Lenin is all the more reason to consider him important.
Anyone Born With a Silver Spoon in His Mouth Should Have It Shoved Down His Throat

The only influence on Lenin was how much he hated his father, who had been elevated to the aristocracy. Yet Lenin also had the Born to Rule attitude Big Shots always embed in their spawn before the spoiled putrid trash start pretending they are rebels.
 

EatTheRich

President
Karl Marx, the Trophy Husband of a Duchess Getting Even With Her Parents

Self-education is far more valid than being a child looking for a father figure, which is the situation at the universities. Once again, your snob Marxism is like saying that only those who studied the Bible at seminaries can tell Christians how to be Christian.
Marx was not in fact the husband of a duchess. He was, however, educated at university, and the theory he helped come up with based on his university studies gave the socialist movement the tools it needed to take state power in Russia, one of the world's great empires, within 2 generations. V.I. Lenin, the principal strategic architect of the revolution there, was also university-educated.

I have nothing against self-education, but it has its characteristic limitations, as does university education. The limitations of the first are myopia, subjectivist one-sidedness, and (as a consequence) increased susceptibility to ruling-class ideology. The limitations of the latter are conformism, conservatism, and direct contamination by ruling-class ideology. The latter, unlike the former, has the advantage of being refined by systematic tests of its practical applicability.
 

EatTheRich

President
Anyone Born With a Silver Spoon in His Mouth Should Have It Shoved Down His Throat

The only influence on Lenin was how much he hated his father, who had been elevated to the aristocracy. Yet Lenin also had the Born to Rule attitude Big Shots always embed in their spawn before the spoiled putrid trash start pretending they are rebels.
Armchair psychology aside, the fact remains that Lenin led a revolution that

1) Ended Russian involvement in WWI, and created the foundation for the German revolution that ended the war.
2) Brought the secret diplomacy of the imperialist powers into the light of day.
3) Essentially eliminated typhus and in general vastly improved health care.
4) Made free education available to all.
5) Liberated the oppressed nationalities from the weight of Great Russian chauvinism.
6) Armed the workers.
7) Gave women the right to vote.
8) Became the first modern country to legalize abortion.
9) Provided immediate relief to the starving workers.
10) Put land and tools in the hands of poor peasants.
11) Increased access to cultural opportunities for the working class.
12) Increased union protection, and improved wages and access to vacation time, for nearly all workers.
 
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