Brexit update.

[Queen Titania]

Stand off.

Macron has said he can't agree to an extension without a good reason. He is pressing for a GE to decide the future of negotiations and won't agree to an extension until one is agreed upon for 12th Dec 2019.

Corbyn is refusing a GE unless an extension is granted.

tic tock - 6 days to Brexit day - tic tock

 

[Spamature]

Stand off.

Macron has said he can't agree to an extension without a good reason. He is pressing for a GE to decide the future of negotiations and won't agree to an extension until one is agreed upon for 12th Dec 2019.

Corbyn is refusing a GE unless an extension is granted.

tic tock - 6 days to Brexit day - tic tock

What changes will a general election make to the situation apart from negotiations with the EU ?

 

[Queen Titania]

What changes will a general election make to the situation apart from negotiations with the EU ?

Probably give the Tories a large majority. Probably finish the Labour Party off. Any which way we would have a Government.

Parliament is 'dead'. It is a 'dead' Parliament (AG). Nothing can happen until we have a Government - not Brexit or anything else much. We need a GE whatever Macron decides.

Boris's letter to Corbyn

https://www.scribd.com/document/431881127/Boris-election-letter-to-Corbyn?fbclid=IwAR0kE3mLbaeJ7kwDZoEPKEyT5pgBSVtko-glvEqVjtVpmBsHbCHPLw1KAz4#from_embed

 

[Spamature]

Probably give the Tories a large majority. Probably finish the Labour Party off. Any which way we would have a Government.

Parliament is 'dead'. It is a 'dead' Parliament (AG). Nothing can happen until we have a Government - not Brexit or anything else much. We need a GE whatever Macron decides.

Boris's letter to Corbyn

https://www.scribd.com/document/431881127/Boris-election-letter-to-Corbyn?fbclid=IwAR0kE3mLbaeJ7kwDZoEPKEyT5pgBSVtko-glvEqVjtVpmBsHbCHPLw1KAz4#from_embed

Is a win for the Torries a sure thing ?

 

[Queen Titania]

Is a win for the Torries a sure thing ?

We know that no election is a sure thing but ----- if the vote isn't split between Boris and Farage even Labour expect Boris to win ----- even, I have it on good authority, in some Northern areas which naturally hate the Tories!

Libdems will get the Remain vote - some inner city areas will vote Labour but Labour have betrayed their working class base.

I don't know what Wales will vote --- because of Labours betrayal it is hard to gage where their old heartlands voters will go.

 

[Queen Titania]

Is a win for the Torries a sure thing ?

Melanie Phillips is right here - I don't always agree with her but she is often right never the less

 

[Spamature]

Melanie Phillips is right here - I don't always agree with her but she is often right never the less

What I get from her interviews is that Brexit boils down to personal feelings and pride in the nation more than it does on gaining any overall advantage economically. It appears that any gain or loss of advantages is purely a secondary consideration in what is almost wholly economic matter in its reality. The problem with personal feelings and pride is they are easy to play on and shape, while hard numbers are not malleable. They will be what they will be regards of how anyone feels.

Is the machinery of govt and business set up and prepared to handle this sea change coming your way in 6 days if Brexit supporters get thier wish ?

 

[Queen Titania]

What I get from her interviews is that Brexit boils down to personal feelings and pride in the nation more than it does on gaining any overall advantage economically. It appears that any gain or loss of advantages is purely a secondary consideration in what is almost wholly economic matter in its reality. The problem with personal feelings and pride is they are easy to play on and shape, while hard numbers are not malleable. They will be what they will be regards of how anyone feels.

Is the machinery of govt and business set up and prepared to handle this sea change coming your way in 6 days if Brexit supporters get thier wish ?

Poppet we haven't had a government since 1972! You really don't get it do you?

John Redwood is coherent on the economic advantages of leaving.

http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2019/10/24/a-new-economic-policy/

 

[Queen Titania]

Brexit day is the 31st Oct 2019.

It is the morning of the 28th - only 3 days to go.

27 other nation states are deciding whether to offer an extension from the 31st Oct to the 31st Jan 2020.

Parliament are to vote to day on whether to hold a GE in early Dec.

27 other nation states say they shall wait to see the outcome of the vote ( about 5 pm) before offering the extension.

It is torture, I tell ya, torture.

Question: Even though Boris asked for an extension, all be it, against his will - will he accept one from the 27 other nation states or will he be brave enough to say Non?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I heard on the radio this morning that the extension was granted, for three months. Sorry to hear it.

 

[Queen Titania]

I heard on the radio this morning that the extension was granted, for three months. Sorry to hear it.

Well not formally yet. Supposedly they are waiting to see what the vote on Boris's motion for a GE on the 12th Dec ( 12th because Uni vacations have begun. In the last election Uni students were openly voting twice for Labour -1st in their Uni town 2nd at their home town) is. He needs a 2/3rd majority to get it passed - which is doubtful since Labour have ordered all of their MPs to abstain as rebel ( Remain) Con MPs will too. SNP want an election pronto though because their ex Leader Salmond's trial for sexual offences goes to court in January. LibDems want one now so that they can take Labour remain voting seats. Dunno about Ireland's DUP - I should imagine they fear one.

But - the EU will be making an offer - and we all know that an offer alone does not a contract make. Brexiteers are praying to all of the gods and goddesses in all the heavens above and below that Boris declines their offer - one he only sought due to coercion backed up by a threat. I could make all sorts of legal arguments as to why the Benn Act was illegal but whilst we still have Blair's Supreme Court and because constitutionally the Courts have no right to interfere in Parliamentary business - and because now there is no time - there is no point.

That fat lady of yours ain't singin' yet!

 

[Queen Titania]

Well not formally yet. Supposedly they are waiting to see what the vote on Boris's motion for a GE on the 12th Dec ( 12th because Uni vacations have begun. In the last election Uni students were openly voting twice for Labour -1st in their Uni town 2nd at their home town) is. He needs a 2/3rd majority to get it passed - which is doubtful since Labour have ordered all of their MPs to abstain as rebel ( Remain) Con MPs will too. SNP want an election pronto though because their ex Leader Salmond's trial for sexual offences goes to court in January. LibDems want one now so that they can take Labour remain voting seats. Dunno about Ireland's DUP - I should imagine they fear one.

But - the EU will be making an offer - and we all know that an offer alone does not a contract make. Brexiteers are praying to all of the gods and goddesses in all the heavens above and below that Boris declines their offer - one he only sought due to coercion backed up by a threat. I could make all sorts of legal arguments as to why the Benn Act was illegal but whilst we still have Blair's Supreme Court and because constitutionally the Courts have no right to interfere in Parliamentary business - and because now there is no time - there is no point.

That fat lady of yours ain't singin' yet!

ps Some are saying that Boris must comply with the offer of an extension due to the Benn Act BUT EU law supersedes UK law, whilst we are still in it, and Art 50 says that after 2 years if there is no withdrawal agreement in place then we leave.

 

[Queen Titania]

The House voted down the motion for an election on Dec 12th. Boris is going to ask again in another way.

We have, as yet, not heard whether he has accepted the extension offer form the EU - though it has not yet been formally offered.

 

[Boltlady]

The House voted down the motion for an election on Dec 12th. Boris is going to ask again in another way.

We have, as yet, not heard whether he has accepted the extension offer form the EU - though it has not yet been formally offered.

Due to some of the meds they have me on and other extenuating circumstances I haven't been able to read large amounts to follow things, however....is there a chance that some of the people in your country will stop offering so much flak when they see how the EU is trying to double what Germany has to pay?

I would think that would have a sobering effect on those who think staying would be a good thing.

 

[Spamature]

Poppet we haven't had a government since 1972! You really don't get it do you?

John Redwood is coherent on the economic advantages of leaving.

http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2019/10/24/a-new-economic-policy/

So leaving allows the Britain to take on more debt. Which is something the govt will likely be force to do anyway when the country leaves the UE.

 

[Queen Titania]

Due to some of the meds they have me on and other extenuating circumstances I haven't been able to read large amounts to follow things, however....is there a chance that some of the people in your country will stop offering so much flak when they see how the EU is trying to double what Germany has to pay?

I would think that would have a sobering effect on those who think staying would be a good thing.

I know it is frightening. We have to get out now or we will be stuck with huge EU debts. People know this but the Remoaners in Parliament are vandals who do not give a damn.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=480180019508260

We are beginning to lose trust now in Boris too, sadly. It will depend on what he stands on in an election 'cos we don't like the 'deal' - which leaves us with the dilemma of who to vote for IF we get a normal election.
Labour voted, for the third time, against an election within the Fixed term Act (FTA) today. Tomorrow Boris will present a motion for a one line bill - for an election - outside the FTA which jokingly the horribly EU corrupt LibDem Leader suggested on TV - and Boris took her up on it.

BUT ............

Though the SNP and LibDems are now, in theory, agreeing to an election it is only IF it is whilst students are still at Uni ( meaning that thousands will vote twice, as they openly did before, 1) in their Uni town 2) in their home town) IF we give the vote to 16 & 17 yr olds IF we give the vote to EU citizens living here IF we give the vote to ex pats, no matter how long they have been away. A Labour Lord in the HoLs is also at the ready to amend the motion for an election into a motion for Remain.


Farage with his new Brexit party is, rightly, criticising Boris's deal and getting a lot of support from angry Brexiteers, BUT mainstream BBC watching voters won't vote for him and the vote could be split with terrible consequences. Tactical voting could get us a decent parliament but not everyone goes along with such plans - do they? Well Remoaners do - some have recently been imprisoned for voter fraud in Peterborough.

The real Brexiteers in Parliament have advised Boris to just walk away from the EU --- but if he did it on or before the 31st he would be breaking UK law ( The Benn Act) even though EU law supersedes it in Art 50 - A PM can't be seen to be breaking UK law and Gina Miller would soon have him in court with Soros money.

ps Boris could have blocked the Benn Act but Corbyn, in Parliament, promised him an election if Boris allowed it through unchallenged - Boris did. Corbyn reneged and is again making demands on Boris if he wants his election he must A and B and C.

So - unless we get a normal General Election and a decent Brexit friendly Parliament this nightmare will continue ad infinitum.

It really is a nightmare - T May has a lot to answer for as do many other MPs still sitting on those Green Benches.

Ps One good thing - Bercow has gone on the 31st and he will NOT get a knighthood as is usual for a Speaker.

 

[Queen Titania]

Due to some of the meds they have me on and other extenuating circumstances I haven't been able to read large amounts to follow things, however....is there a chance that some of the people in your country will stop offering so much flak when they see how the EU is trying to double what Germany has to pay?

I would think that would have a sobering effect on those who think staying would be a good thing.

Sorry you are still so unwell and on meds darling but it is lovely to see you posting.

My love and best wishes, kisses xxx

 

[Alinvegas]

I am still smiling --- thank God for Boris.

OK so today, Saturday, the House sat to discuss the 'new deal' that Boris has negotiated with Brussels and then vote on it. The House has only ever sat on a Saturday before in times of war. Serious sh'it!

Our political set up is different to yours in many ways including that the executive comes out of the legislature. The Speaker of the House is very powerful and is, by convention, supposed to be neutral. The Order paper - order of discussion in the House - is the Gov's prerogative by convention.

Because there cannot be a 'hard border' on the only land border between the UK and the EU ( Good Friday Agreement) in Ireland May's deal had trapped the whole of the UK under EU laws until the EU decided we could go. Her deal was voted down by Parliament twice. May left No 10 and Boris stepped in. The EU had said they would not negotiate further. Boris said 'OK then we shall leave under WTO on the 31st Oct 2019' - exit day by Art 50. The EU opened up the negotiations again. Meanwhile back in Parliament the Speaker gave the Order Paper to the opposition who drafted and passed a law ( in 1 day!) forcing Boris to beg the EU for an extension if a new deal had not been found and approved by the EU and Parliament by 19th Oct 2019. An agreement between Gov and the EU was found - it isn't perfect, by any means, but it is a beginning to a Brexit end with no hard border in Ireland - It is over 60 pages long so i shan't bore you with it.

The new deal was put before the house today --- BUT yesterday an amendment to the deal, drafted by Oliver 'poll tax' Letwin ( spit spit) was allowed by the Speaker --- the amendment demands that Boris beg for an extension even if the Bill/deal is approved by Parliament. Parliament decided on the amendment first and being a Remoaner Parliament voted for it --- making the vote on Boris's deal void.

The Gov after a courteous few words from Boris, just got up and walked out saying 'leave them too it' - loooooooooool Bercow's ( Speaker) face was a picture - he was flummoxed! The Leader of the House ( Mogg) said, in a short point of order, that the Gov would bring this back to the House on Monday ( well a part of it ) - and soon after that he also walked out. Bercow was dumbfounded! looooooooooool For the next 1 1/2 hours the Remoaner's whined --- until a very very learned MP stood up and said that 'it used to be perfectly normal that the Gov set out the next days discussion the day before'. Bercow was put in is place --- he is a bully who as trampled all over our constitution and Parliamentary conventions and think's he is god!

Remoaners and Bercow have been going back and forth to Brussels begging them not to deal with Boris.

This is the best game of Chess ever played out in Parliament - Boris's move

Reminds me of our situation between Trump and our House. They hate him so much they are prepared to destroy our country just to see he doesn't get his way. I bet Ms Nancy goes home to cry ever night because the people back Trump and not her. LOL. What a wonderful country...

 

[Queen Titania]

So leaving allows the Britain to take on more debt. Which is something the govt will likely be force to do anyway when the country leaves the UE.

It really does depend on how we leave the EU.

 

[Queen Titania]

Reminds me of our situation between Trump and our House. They hate him so much they are prepared to destroy our country just to see he doesn't get his way. I bet Ms Nancy goes home to cry ever night because the people back Trump and not her. LOL. What a wonderful country...

Trump is not the topic in this one thread - if you don't mind! You have the rest of the forum to talk about Trump!