I'm Calling Bullshit on this one

[degsme]

Oh I believe his prediction I just don't believe his analysis as to how this will affect us and why it will affect us. As a Global population we are evolving into another form of beast that lives more on the services side than on the practical side

Based on what? US Manufacturing has grown about 50% net net in the last 20 years. How is that "less on the practical side"? Its just that as with farm work, the net LABOR requirements has gone down.

 

[justoffal]

Because it is a backdoor equation for abject poverty....and with our propensity to try to fix that poverty with entitlement there is no possible way we can keep up with an exploding population unless they move back into the low end labor activities.

 

[degsme]

Because it is a backdoor equation for abject poverty....and with our propensity to try to fix that poverty with entitlement there is no possible way we can keep up with an exploding population unless they move back into the low end labor activities.

Again Why? Look if you have a large accumulation of idle capital, spending it down is not an equation for poverty.

If you have a large amount of resource assets that you sell of (but don't actually engage in production) - again you are not in trouble. That's what Russia and the ME nations are doing.


Again, its more complicated than you make it out to be.

Nor is a population growing at less than 1% "exploding".

 

[justoffal]

I am talking about ability to produce the goods that are needed to survive...to exist...food, housing, health care if you will.....there is nothing complicated about simple totals...stay with the the totals and forget the economics policies unless you have a good recipe for paper jambalaya.

This is the one thing Keynes never dealt with head on....aggregate demand is also a death sentence if you don't have the aggregate production capabilities to satisfy that demand.

The world's population will double in the next forty years.....with nearly 60% of the world having trouble keeping its calorie count in a respectable zone per capita how the hell are we, with declining production capabilities going to feed the new population levels????

Wooley nailed this one...we dont' always agree...but on this one I am with him 100%

 

[justoffal]

I know that that's true...the problem isn't the growth the problem is the people that are left behind...it's easy to say that they need to train up....but much harder to actually make that happen...sooooo if we have all these extra people left out of the system...I would say that Wooley is correct....the obvious fact is that we have too many people....I think that is a totally logical analysis. Other than that it's time to blow up the robots and bring back those manufacturing jobs so people can eat.

 

[degsme]

I am talking about ability to produce the goods that are needed to survive...to exist...food, housing, health care if you will.....there is nothing complicated about simple totals...stay with the the totals and forget the economics policies unless you have a good recipe for paper jambalaya.

Not sure how this fits with the discussion

This is the one thing Keynes never dealt with head on....aggregate demand is also a death sentence if you don't have the aggregate production capabilities to satisfy that demand.

And again, in the time that the USA's population went up by 50%, GDP Doubled and MFG production went up by more than 50%...

The world's population will double in the next forty years

And how does the USA deal with THE WORLD's population? Remember Wooley was talking about US popl.

 

[degsme]

note - world caloric intake issues are a legitimate discussion, but that's a different issue.

 

[Bruce]

No its not true. Unless of course you consider slavery as "cheap labor" as well as theft of the land developed by the Spanish in the SW and in general theft of tribal lands.

But what "built this country" from an also ran power prior to WWII to the dominant economy in the world is... Union Labor from WWII through post WWII. Henry Ford's notion of paying his workers a wage that they could afford to buy a car with was the right call. THAT is what exploded the Car industry - as well as GM's novel GMAC credit to average workers.

Not "cheap labor".

Good history Degs! Without a fight for a better life the USA would still be ran by the carpet baggers of old. Even Ford did'nt give i without a fight. A lot of innovation and new tech came from sources without Harvard degrees. What I see in America now is a class of people that because of teachings within the home have no ambition to pursue that which is'nt given to them. While I chastise the 1%
a portion of the masses will have to be made thirsty enough to search for the water.

 

[Bruce]

so, How are you going to accomplish that?

Are you Send people to the "showers" like the Germans did to the Jews?

Or are you going to do what the Eugenicists did, mainly mandate sterilization and abortion of those deemed genetically unacceptable?

How's about family planning and contraception? Hows about a worker program for immigrants to work here and go home? Sex educations been around for a long time now. It started in the 60's or before and we were being taught to replace ourselves and call it quit's so as to not over populate. It worked out pretty well untill the repubs decided that they were losing profit's because they did'nt have enough slave labor to harvest and bodies to buy the product so Mr Reagan decided that folk's coming in could just be americans without being americans. Now we have a class of people that are'nt really americans with citizenship paper's. And guess what, those coming in use sex as their income. Let's pump out another baby so we can teach him/her to pump out babies to keep that assistance rolling in and free healthcare.. Family planning is not dictating to a woman as to not have an abortion.

 

[888888]

Exactly correct. But I think the left also understands this. What they want is an artificially high wage structure that pays people who don't have the brain power to do anything other than dig ditches or mop floors a "middle class" wage. The fact that you can't build a strong economy on such shaky economics is what eludes them.

You can't have a strong economy without a strong middle class. and expecting everyone who doesn't have a college degree to work for what amounts to be Illegal wages is not going to build a strong middle class. Oh I would like to see some of you guys do the manual labor.
Not to mention if you have a high tech product that is better than the junk from overseas you can compete if the people are given the chance.

But what is and has been happened is upping the bottom line, where jobs were sent overseas at the same time corp's were being helped by our republican friends to do it by getting special tax provisions.

When outsourcing is punished instead of promoted then manufacturing will come back somewhat, but new high tech jobs need to be developed along with it, so there is an upward mobility in place.