Lame November jobs growth number - 155K

[Raoul_Luke]

I'm asking you to think...tough task, I know. Did the CEOs of a lot of companies set prices so high they killed demand?

They were forced to - FDR mandated that they not cut wages. In order to make it work, he allowed them to form cartels. What a shock, it didn't expand employment OR economic activity. This isn't rocket science...

 

[middleview]

So what, exactly, did the "stimulus" do?

View attachment 41105

In fact, if you add the increase in GDP year on year from 2002 to 2009 it equals $3,5 trillion. If you add the deficits from those years it equals $2 trillion.

If you do the same from 2010 to 2017 you get $2.7 GDP and $6.5 deficits.

Bush didn't have the worst economy since 1929 walking in the door. Obama did.

https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306

You will notice I took the increase in the deficit...but the more accurate number would be the column labeled "Debt Increase"... since Bush carried the cost of the wars off books.

 

[Raoul_Luke]

And then George HW Bush, faced with a steeply rising debt, started cutting defense spending, closed bases and cut active duty troop levels. Reagan's stimulus was not investment...it was simply spending to encourage economic activity. You argue that the FED buying up MBSs was artificial...so was Reagan's defense spending. Once Bush started cutting it we had a recession....remember?

The USSR fell apart for a lot of reasons, the war in Afghanistan, the arms race, the shoddy products the centralized economy produced...which could only be sold to captive economies in the East Block. Gorbachev gets as much credit as Reagan does. Meanwhile, as Cheney said, Reagan proved deficits don't matter.

Yes, so what? Both are examples of artificial "growth" that causes a recession when it is inevitably ended. Are you TRYING to make my points for me here???

 

[middleview]

Active in labor force:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LRAC25TTUSQ156N

So while you point to that as evidence of Obama's poor performance...it was actually a trend going back decades...but it was Obama's fault, right?

 

[middleview]

Yes, so what? Both are examples of artificial "growth" that causes a recession when it is inevitably ended. Are you TRYING to make my points for me here???

So are you now saying that Reagan did actually try policies that you don't like? So much for sainthood for him, eh?

 

[Raoul_Luke]

In fact, if you add the increase in GDP year on year from 2002 to 2009 it equals $3,5 trillion. If you add the deficits from those years it equals $2 trillion.

If you do the same from 2010 to 2017 you get $2.7 GDP and $6.5 deficits.

Bush didn't have the worst economy since 1929 walking in the door. Obama did.

https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306

You will notice I took the increase in the deficit...but the more accurate number would be the column labeled "Debt Increase"... since Bush carried the cost of the wars off books.

Precisely! Again, are you trying to make my points for me or what? In fact neither Bush's nor Obama's deficits produced organic economic growth. Sheesh!

 

[Raoul_Luke]

So while you point to that as evidence of Obama's poor performance...it was actually a trend going back decades...but it was Obama's fault, right?

Obama did nothing to reverse it. In fact it got worse on his watch. Trump turned it around. Deal with it...

 

[Raoul_Luke]

So are you now saying that Reagan did actually try policies that you don't like? So much for sainthood for him, eh?

Nobody is perfect. Who did more long term damage to the economy - Reagan or Obama?

 

[middleview]

They were forced to - FDR mandated that they not cut wages. In order to make it work, he allowed them to form cartels. What a shock, it didn't expand employment OR economic activity. This isn't rocket science...

Forced to increase prices? Bullshit. He ALLLOWED them...meaning he dropped government controls...I thought that was what you wanted....you can't seem to make up you mind...more regulation or less, which is it?

 

[reason10]

And the October jobs numbers were revised downward.

Trade deficits soaring, budget deficits soaring, markets plunging, jobs growth stalling, economic growth falling...

Here we go...

https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/07/economy/november-jobs-report/index.html

CNN?

And you wonder why everybody says liberals are such idiots.
We are in the largest economic expansion in history and unemployment is at an all time historic LOW.

Hell, might as well ask Mother Jones their opinion as well, since you are obviously allergic to facts.

 

[middleview]

Nobody is perfect. Who did more long term damage to the economy - Reagan or Obama?

Reagan...since he established the trend in deficit spending. GHW Bush was right when he called Reagan's policies "Voodoo Economics".

You say Trump has reversed the trend in LFPR for 25 to 56 year old males. How did he do that?

 

[reason10]

Nope. Read the whole post.

Jobs were up, wages were up, unemployment was down - all a part of the record shattering streak of economic improvement under Obama. As the post said, backed by a link.

Today? Jobs growth number decreasing, economic growth stalling, markets plunging, trade and budget deficits soaring...

Ya think “Tariff Man” is screwing up the geometrically improving economy he inherited from Obama?

;-)

Only a total [Unwelcome language removed] IDIOT thinks Obama had ANYTHING to do with this modern day economic miracle.

 

[middleview]

CNN?

And you wonder why everybody says liberals are such idiots.
We are in the largest economic expansion in history and unemployment is at an all time historic LOW.

Hell, might as well ask Mother Jones their opinion as well, since you are obviously allergic to facts.

1. It is not an all time low. That is more of Trump's bullshit.
2. Trump has actually lowered unemployment by .7%....BFD. Obama lowered it from 10% to 4.5%.
3. That economic expansion started in 2010.

 

[middleview]

Only a total [Unwelcome language removed] IDIOT thinks Obama had ANYTHING to do with this modern day economic miracle.

Be specific...what has Trump done? Don't give me vague bullshit like "Oh, he cut lots of Obama regulations"...what regulations did he cut? That only ones I know of would have limited coal mine waste products in rivers and streams and that certainly has not created a lot of jobs.

 

[Bugsy McGurk]

Only a total [Unwelcome language removed] IDIOT thinks Obama had ANYTHING to do with this modern day economic miracle.

The “economic miracle” being job growth numbers less than Obama’s last two years? Or perhaps quarterly growth rate figures less than Obama’s best quarters? Maybe the soaring budget deficits? The soaring trade deficits? The plunging markets?

Ya think you might be brainwashed?

;-)

 

[middleview]

Obama did nothing to reverse it. In fact it got worse on his watch. Trump turned it around. Deal with it...

WTF! The LFPR is about the same as it was going back to 2014. You pick on one demographic and say it indicates a success for Trump. The jobs numbers haven't really changed much...so what is the bottom line? Some people are retiring and younger people are taking their place. Is that Trump's plan?

Face it...Trump is just a passenger on this bus. He'll do shit to be in the news, but everything he actually touches is turning to shit. His interference in the trade with other countries is not working out the way he said...His promise to pay off the national debt is long forgotten. His ability to hire a good team is painfully lacking and now he'll appoint a Fox News personality to be UN ambassador...Are you f*cking kidding me?

 

[Bugsy McGurk]

WTF! The LFPR is about the same as it was going back to 2014. You pick on one demographic and say it indicates a success for Trump. The jobs numbers haven't really changed much...so what is the bottom line? Some people are retiring and younger people are taking their place. Is that Trump's plan?

Face it...Trump is just a passenger on this bus. He'll do shit to be in the news, but everything he actually touches is turning to shit. His interference in the trade with other countries is not working out the way he said...His promise to pay off the national debt is long forgotten. His ability to hire a good team is painfully lacking and now he'll appoint a Fox News personality to be UN ambassador...Are you f*cking kidding me?

Budget deficits soaring, trade deficits soaring, Trump sycophants clapping like trained seals.

;-)

 

[middleview]

CNN?

And you wonder why everybody says liberals are such idiots.
We are in the largest economic expansion in history and unemployment is at an all time historic LOW.

Hell, might as well ask Mother Jones their opinion as well, since you are obviously allergic to facts.

I wonder why you think you can speak for "everybody". Everybody I know wonders who the 36% are who approve of Trump's performance. Everybody I know is confused by the folks, like you, who make shit up to justify their continued support for such a moron that he can't even keep from tweeting silly bullshit and out right lies on a daily basis.

 

[middleview]

CEOs are a pretty risk averse group, wrt politics. None are going to come out and say a President is causing them to lay people off. Can you imagine the shit storm that would cause in the leftist media? Well, almost none:

https://www.businessinsider.com/wynn-ceo-steve-wynn-conference-call-transcript-obama-2011-7

The fact is that the more Obama's electoral chances surged, and the more "I think it works better when you spread the wealth around" comments he made, the faster companies shed workers.

I've already told you why Lehman "went under." Government interventions in the banking system where the Bush Administration bailed out Bear Stearns and then refused to do the same for Lehmn - ensuring that no capitalist in their right mind would make a bid for the company. But Bush was on the way out, so you would expect the market to see that as a positive, except it was Obama, and even worse POTUS, on his way in. It was a perfect storm - just like 1933.

I'm not here to defend Trump. He is odious and his policies are a hot mess. But he is, at least, pro-market. And his relaxing of the Obama era anti-capitalist agenda has led to unmistakable improvements in key private sector economic indicators:

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View attachment 41109

Which has led to improvements in key overall indicators:

View attachment 41110

View attachment 41112


Yes, and including the 25 - 54 LFPR; which is the one that best measures the economy's health.

So your claim that they were laying people off in 2008 simply because they feared Obama was going to win is something you pulled outta yer ass, because no CEO would actually have done that. It costs money to lay off your work force...the impact on morale also is a drag on productivity. I was managing people in 1987 and was told to prepare for layoffs...luckily it didn't happen..but I know the discussions that go into it at a management level.

Nobody lays people off as long as they are profitable unless they are terminating product lines.

 

[Drumcollie]

Listen to this one, trying to blame Obama for the near-depression he inherited from GWB.

Just deplorable.

Listen to this one, trying to blame GWB for the near-depression caused by Democrats because before Pelosi became speaker everything was just fine.