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Obama has a lot of gall claiming he handed off the current recovery...

Discussion in 'Latest Political News and Current Events' started by Raoul_Luke, Sep 9, 2018.

  1. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    "And then the reckless behavior of financial elites triggered a massive financial crisis, 10 years ago this week, a crisis that resulted in the worst recession in any of our lifetimes and caused years of hardship for the American people, for many of your parents, for many of your families. Most of you weren't old enough to fully focus on what was going on at the time, but when I came into office in 2009, we were losing 800,000 jobs a month. 800,000. Millions of people were losing their homes. Many were worried we were entering into a second Great Depression."

    And with good reason!

    We've seen again and again and again where the left has bleated about the massive job losses Obama "inherited." It would be wise to look under the hood of that claim. When you do so it's pretty easy to make a case that he in fact had a rather strong hand in why the decline accelerated before he entered office (and that it in fact never really "recovered" at all on his watch, but that is a subject for another thread).

    Obama clearly ran on an anti-capitalist agenda (see: Joe the Plumber interchange) and one might reasonably expect businesses to anticipate the future, right? That is precisely what they do day in and day out. So how would a rational businessman react to the indications that Obama was likely going to win the election walking away? If you are thinking downsize, you are 100% correct. And what then would you think their reaction would be once he actually won? If you are thinking accelerate their downsizing, once again you are a winner! So if that, in fact, was the dynamic in place at the time, how would you expect the job loss statistics to look like for 2008? If you are thinking they would accelerate in the later months, especially in the fourth quarter, go smoke a cigar - you aced the exam.

    Furthermore, job losses accelerated sharply over the course of the year, with an average of 216,000 jobs lost per month over the year but an average of 510,000 lost per month in the last three months…

    Screen Shot 2018-09-09 at 11.10.06 AM.


    https://www.epi.org/publication/job_losses_ballooned_in_final_quarter_of_2008/

    So whenever you hear anyone, including Obama saying he "inherited" the massive job losses, the fact is that this is propaganda. No one (even a lefty) can argue that businesses would simply ignore the looming changes in the economic environment stemming from a Presidential election until after the inauguration. And, in looking at Obama's campaign platform, what did they see:

    We will start by renewing the American Dream for a new era – with the same new hope and new ideas that propelled Franklin Delano Roosevelt towards the New Deal…

    http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=78283

    They would clearly be justified, based on that passage in the preface to Obama's platform, in anticipating a pretty crappy economic agenda, along the lines of FDR's interventionism on steroids that caused the Great Depression. And, indeed, they would rationally fear another economic depression stemming from a President (fundamental transformation) Obama's efforts to emulate FDR. And that is exactly what they got.

    Obama didn't "inherit" 750,000 a month job losses - he CAUSED them!
     
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  2. Bugsy McGurk

    Bugsy McGurk President

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    Truly deplorable fiction.

    No sane person denies that Obama inherited near-depression conditions, including a complete collapse in the jobs market. But Trump zombies are happy to deny it.

    And then we have the “fall back fantasy” - the fiction that the economy collapsed because people knew Obama would be the next president. Of course, nobody knew that. But more to the point, it’s pretzel logic - the economy only started recovering after Obama came into office, followed by a record shattering streak of economic growth and jobs growth. An ever-growing economy that Obama bequeathed to Trump.

    Trump zombies sure do hate reality. It just doesn’t square with everything they’ve been programmed to say.
     
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  3. middleview

    middleview President Supporting Member

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    The fact is that home foreclosures went through the roof starting in 2004. Lehman didn't go under because they knew Obama was going to be president. It is idiotic to claim that companies who were profitable and doing well would start laying people off because they anticipated a presidential election. The GDP dropped 8% in 2008 with a recession that started in mid-2007.

    There goes what was left of your claim of objectivity.
     
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  4. Bugsy McGurk

    Bugsy McGurk President

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    It’s amazing.

    We tell them in advance that their foolish deregulation of banking institutions will ultimately collapse the economy, it happens, and then they deny that it happened. It happened with the S&L’s in the 1980’s, and it happened again with the big banks in 2007-2008.

    We predict the future more accurately than wingers can perceive the past.
     
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  5. middleview

    middleview President Supporting Member

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    They act as if we all have forgotten history. It was republican legislation that mandated a lack of federal oversight for the derivatives market. Clinton signed it...and once implemented during the Bush administration...and it was obvious that it had become a runaway train...Bush did nothing. Instead Cox laid off about 100 people from SEC enforcement and investigations groups. There was one person left in the Office of National Risk Assessment. Gee...what could go wrong?

    The Bush administration changed liquidity rules and allowed banks to borrow $40 per $1 in assets...up from $15::$1. If they invested in derivatives (Mortgage backed securities) and those investments dropped just 3% they'd be insolvent and would be forced to sell assets to return to solvency...that would force a downward spiral. Short selling made it worse.

    Obama didn't cause Lehman's failure. Obama didn't cause Washington Mutual or Countrywide to give mortgages to people who couldn't hope to make the payments once their variable rate mortgages reset and the payments doubled. Obama didn't cause Aurora Loan Services (owned by Lehman) to offer 125% mortgages.
     
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  6. redtide

    redtide Mayor

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    well obama is a lying scum bag who sold US out so it is to be expected that he will lie as that is truly his strongest skill
     
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  7. MrMike

    MrMike Collude daily!

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    Obama is a proven LIAR so him making false accomplishment claims now even though history disproves his claims is not much of a surprise.

    You see, poor Obammy wants something to hang a positive legacy but all he really has is his pimping of racial division, resulting destruction and death and utter incompetence in his role as POTUS. This is what happens when you let Liberals essentially go with Affirmative Action to elect a totally useless POTUS so they can be "historic" and feel good about it:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    But wait.... Obammy did accomplish something! :eek:

    [​IMG]

    And.... :oops:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    CASE CLOSED!

    :p
     
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  8. Dawg

    Dawg President Supporting Member

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    I'm soooooooooo glad O is bacccccccccccccck

    [​IMG]let the investigations begin
     
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  9. The Sage of Main Street

    The Sage of Main Street Mayor

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    The Obaminable Snowjobman

    I wouldn't call performing "lying." He's a gyrating, tap dancing lawn jockey for the gated- community Limousine Liberals and all the anti-American foreign powers.
     
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  10. EatTheRich

    EatTheRich Senator

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    Obama was not anywhere near the front-runner until after the housing market crashed and brought down the financial industry with it. And of course the depression ... which was worse in countries that adopted your preferred policies ... was worldwide.
     
  11. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    That is absurd! McCain sealed his loss as soon as he selected Sarah Palin to be his VP candidate. In fact, everybody knew Obama was going to win as soon as (crazy old) McCain sewed up the Republican nomination. Any suggestion to the contrary is propaganda.
     
  12. EatTheRich

    EatTheRich Senator

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    Yet McCain was ahead in the polls up till the housing market crashed. And why would Palin have sunk the ticket when she was more popular than McCain and when Trump won in 2016 on the basis of similar populist themes, but in a much better economic environment and the U.S. standing stronger internationally?
     
  13. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    How in the hell do you come up with that? Because Americans couldn't wait to get them some more of those "Republican" policies that caused the crash and had us stuck in the quagmire of permanent war? What planet were you on in 2008???
     
  14. EatTheRich

    EatTheRich Senator

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    Yes, after the crash Obama had an advantage ... which implies that the prospect of his election did not lead to the crash, before which it was unlikely.
     
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  15. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    Bear Stearns collapsed in April 2008. The housing market began its steady decline in 2007. Your argument here refutes itself...
     
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  16. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    The recession started in December 2007. It was a fairly normal (if severe) downturn until Spetember:

    Screen Shot 2018-09-09 at 8.20.04 PM.

    Obama was ahead in the polls pretty much throughout the second half of the year:

    Screen Shot 2018-09-09 at 8.27.47 PM.

    Look, I'm getting sick and tired of having to correct all these leftist canards. I do it every fricking time, and yet you still think you can get away with propaganda bullshit like claiming Obama only got a leg up on McCain right before the election. I win, you lose.
     
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  17. EatTheRich

    EatTheRich Senator

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    Your argument doesn’t support your claim. On the contrary, it shows that the economy collapsed first, and Obama became the front-runner second.
     
  18. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    You can replay the propaganda on this episode as many times as you want but that still doesn't make it true. The FACT is that the huge job losses that you keep saying Obama "inherited" only occurred after it became pretty clear he was going to win (and implement his FDR style depression producing agenda). Businesses invest (or disinvest) based on their perceptions of what will occur in the future, not what occurred in the past. That's just a simple fact, taught in every B-school in America. The notion that Obama's surge in the polls:

    Screen Shot 2018-09-09 at 8.27.47 PM.

    And his stated intention to resurrect FDR's economy killing progressive agenda had nothing to do with the acceleration of job losses over the fourth quarter of 2008 (and the first quarter of 2009) is, quite frankly, unserious.
     
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  19. Raoul_Luke

    Raoul_Luke Mayor

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    It got worse AFTER Obama became the front-runner:

    Screen Shot 2018-09-09 at 11.10.06 AM.

    There's the data. If you think it doesn't show that, explain why - don't claim that is doesn't show what it, well, shows.
     
  20. EatTheRich

    EatTheRich Senator

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    It got worse all over the world. The opening stages of a depression predictably take some months to unfold.

    At any rate, we know that as it turns out the Obama administration was great for American business. Anyone betting otherwise lost their shirt.
     

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