The left likes to suggest that capitalism "requires" government...

[Lukey]

I'm not so sure. I'm pretty sure the invention of commerce (trade) predates the earliest attempts at organized political efforts to create a governing structure. So I think it is safe to assume that capitalism (trade) existed for some not inconsequential period before government ever entered the picture. And as I pondered that concept on the drive into work this morning, it struck me that in all likelihood, the earliest efforts to form a governance structure were taken by those who realized that the ability to affect the economy's winners and loses would accrue great power (and wealth). So the fact is that the government class is the ultimate (and earliest) rentiers...

 

[IndependentinWis]

I'm not so sure. I'm pretty sure the invention of commerce (trade) predates the earliest attempts at organized political efforts to create a governing structure. So I think it is safe to assume that capitalism (trade) existed for some not inconsequential period before government ever entered the picture. And as I pondered that concept on the drive into work this morning, it struck me that in all likelihood, the earliest efforts to form a governance structure were taken by those who realized that the ability to affect the economy's winners and loses would accrue great power (and wealth). So the fact is that the government class is the ultimate (and earliest) rentiers...

If you know anything about capitalism, it is based on competition. Government is here to insure that competition happens and that monopolies don't kill competition. Even with government we have allowed some companies to get too big and thus reduced competition.

 

[Bugsy McGurk]

I'm not so sure. I'm pretty sure the invention of commerce (trade) predates the earliest attempts at organized political efforts to create a governing structure. So I think it is safe to assume that capitalism (trade) existed for some not inconsequential period before government ever entered the picture. And as I pondered that concept on the drive into work this morning, it struck me that in all likelihood, the earliest efforts to form a governance structure were taken by those who realized that the ability to affect the economy's winners and loses would accrue great power (and wealth). So the fact is that the government class is the ultimate (and earliest) rentiers...

Just "the left" feels that way?

You prefer anarchy?

 

[as seen on tv]

government is required not by capitalism, but by

• violent criminals
• international threats to our peace and stability
• uniform and safe transportation infrastructure
• drug and food testing

 

[Lukey]

If you know anything about capitalism, it is based on competition. Government is here to insure that competition happens and that monopolies don't kill competition. Even with government we have allowed some companies to get too big and thus reduced competition.

Government creates regulation (and tax cost), which raises the barriers to entry, which reduces, not "enhances" competition. This isn't rocket science:

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2014/10/regulation-killing-opportunity

And everything the left believes is demonstrably wrong!

 

[Deleted member 21794]

Just "the left" feels that way?

You prefer anarchy?

What, you think he's an anti-Trump protester?

 

[Craig]

I'm not so sure. I'm pretty sure the invention of commerce (trade) predates the earliest attempts at organized political efforts to create a governing structure. So I think it is safe to assume that capitalism (trade) existed for some not inconsequential period before government ever entered the picture. And as I pondered that concept on the drive into work this morning, it struck me that in all likelihood, the earliest efforts to form a governance structure were taken by those who realized that the ability to affect the economy's winners and loses would accrue great power (and wealth). So the fact is that the government class is the ultimate (and earliest) rentiers...

When were weights and measures codified?

 

[Lukey]

When were weights and measures codified?

After goods trading became firmly established.

 

[Craig]

After goods trading became firmly established.

And so to establish honesty and fair dealing to a system that desperately required it to more greatly flourish, they were long ago codified.

Part of that requirement stems from the fact is that my kush, or cubit, is 4 inches longer than my wife's cubit. With such tremendous variation, more precise measurements were required. This goes back to at least Hammurabi's times.

 

[Lukey]

And so to establish honesty and fair dealing to a system that desperately required it to more greatly flourish, they were long ago codified.

Part of that requirement stems from the fact is that my kush, or cubit, is 4 inches longer than my wife's cubit. With such tremendous variation, more precise measurements were required. This goes back to at least Hammurabi's times.

That's the government playing the role of referee, which is not a problem. I never suggesting there wasn't a role for government in a market economy - I simply pointed out the stupidity of saying the markets can't exist without it.

It's when government grows to the point where dishonest people can's rip off their customers anymore so they influence government to start picking winners (them) and losers (the rest of us).

 

[ObamacareForever]

I'm not so sure. I'm pretty sure the invention of commerce (trade) predates the earliest attempts at organized political efforts to create a governing structure. So I think it is safe to assume that capitalism (trade) existed for some not inconsequential period before government ever entered the picture. And as I pondered that concept on the drive into work this morning, it struck me that in all likelihood, the earliest efforts to form a governance structure were taken by those who realized that the ability to affect the economy's winners and loses would accrue great power (and wealth). So the fact is that the government class is the ultimate (and earliest) rentiers...

Here's a fun scenario: a snake oil salesman is selling his stuff as a cure for cancer. He has 2 potential customers, the first one buys it, takes it, and falls over dead, the second guy witnesses the whole situation and decides not to buy the snake oil. market forces prevail and the snake oil salesman goes out of business. but what do the capitalists tell the first guy?

 

[Lukey]

Here's a fun scenario: a snake oil salesman is selling his stuff as a cure for cancer. He has 2 potential customers, the first one buys it, takes it, and falls over dead, the second guy witnesses the whole situation and decides not to buy the snake oil. market forces prevail and the snake oil salesman goes out of business. but what do the capitalists tell the first guy?

If something sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

 

[gabriel]

I'm not so sure. I'm pretty sure the invention of commerce (trade) predates the earliest attempts at organized political efforts to create a governing structure. So I think it is safe to assume that capitalism (trade) existed for some not inconsequential period before government ever entered the picture. And as I pondered that concept on the drive into work this morning, it struck me that in all likelihood, the earliest efforts to form a governance structure were taken by those who realized that the ability to affect the economy's winners and loses would accrue great power (and wealth). So the fact is that the government class is the ultimate (and earliest) rentiers...

lol! the derivative scandal of 2008 sure puts the lie to that simplistic theory!! lol

 

[Lukey]

lol! the derivative scandal of 2008 sure puts the lie to that simplistic theory!! lol

As if you even understand it. Do you even know what a "derivative" is? How many middle and working class people owned derivatives? The only "scandal" was the government's interference in the free markets, which led the rich to become over leveraged in the (correct) belief that the government had their backs.

 

[gabriel]

As if you even understand it. Do you even know what a "derivative" is? How many middle and working class people owned derivatives? The only "scandal" was the government's interference in the free markets, which led the rich to become over leveraged in the (correct) belief that the government had their backs.

psssst! pension funds owned them. stick to what you know son.

 

[ObamacareForever]

If something sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

Haha! You can't tell him anything because he's dead. It's the first generation problem. It's the reason capitalism needs regulations

 

[Lukey]

psssst! pension funds owned them. stick to what you know son.

You mean the "defined benefit" pension funds run by the unions and governments? How is that capitalism's fault?

 

[gabriel]

You mean the "defined benefit" pension funds run by the unions and governments? How is that capitalism's fault?

i mean pension plans of all types. like I said, better you confine yourself to things you understand.

 

[Lukey]

Haha! You can't tell him anything because he's dead. It's the first generation problem. It's the reason capitalism needs regulations

Good thing the water departments are heavily regulated, then, right?

http://blog.acton.org/archives/84667-explainer-what-you-should-know-about-the-flint-water-crisis.html?gclid=CP_-mubPtswCFcNkhgodnMYEhQ

Oops! This is why anti-capitalist economic systems always fail - the leftists keep demanding ever more ineffective regulation until the point where the economy stagnates:

https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/M2V

Stick around and read my stuff - maybe you will learn something...

 

[RickWA]

Here's a fun scenario: a snake oil salesman is selling his stuff as a cure for cancer. He has 2 potential customers, the first one buys it, takes it, and falls over dead, the second guy witnesses the whole situation and decides not to buy the snake oil. market forces prevail and the snake oil salesman goes out of business. but what do the capitalists tell the first guy?

The dead guy?

Vote Democrat.