degsme
Council Member
WOW So many lthings that are eithe definitional claims, unsubstantiated beliefs or simply wrong
First off, without government regulation there is no "free market". Because without government protection of private property, or the enforcement of contracts or the prosectuion of fraud, so called "free markets"devolve almost instantly into "might makes right". And since you cannot point to a single regulation that currently exists in the marketplace tht is NOT based in either of the three things I listed, your notion that somehow there is some sort of involuntary coerceion is silly.
As for wealth-transfer. "Wealth transfer" is just that. Transfering weatlh from one person to another. Nothing more, nothing less. Whether it is voluntary or not is irrelevant.
That's simply a basic economic analysis of what "wealth redistribution" is: changing the balance of wealth before and after the transaction. See you want to change "wealth redistribution" to mean "taxes to pay for things you don't want to pay for"... but you know that such a complaint sounds like whining. So you try and disguise it by using the term "Wealth Redistribution ". Except that "wealth redistribution" ALSO includes much of how the so called "free market" works.
As for usurping your labor - your definition here is straight out of Marx. So the Marxist here is you - not me. (that's the irony - most so called "capitalists" who are anti-tax are making the Marxist "fair pay for labor" arguement).
Now since you have no prohibition on moving out of the USA and into any other nation that will have you,, and sine there are clearly nations without the kind of government and regulations that we have in the USA - YOUR PRESENCE HERE, means you are tacitly in voluntary agreement to pay those taxes. Thus there is no "involuntary wealth transfer" going on at all. There may be "wealth transfer" you personally do not think should take place - but that's hardly "involuntary", since you can VOLUNTARILY CHOOSE TO OPT OUT.
The problem of course is that every nation that has the kind of government you advocate - is frankly a sh!thole. And it is a sh!thole mainly because without most of the policies you complain so bitterly about,
And yet that's what you advocate.
Now whether or not we ran on taxes on Commerce exclusively (we did not BTW, the USA sold land, borrowed money, printed money, taxed voting, and collected all manner of fees) is irrelevant. Nothing in ARticle 1 Section 8 precludes taxation of Income. Income taxation preceded Wilson by some 110 years. THE FIRST INCOME TAX WAS PROPOSED BY THE FOUNDING FATHERS as a way to pay for the War of 1812. The first income tax was put into law 50 years later in 1861 fifty two years before Woodrow Wilson.
So even your American History is made up.
That is a matter of FACTUAL RECORD. It has nothing to do with belief. And since it is a DEMONSTRABLE FACT, the "ignoramous" here is the one of us that is ignorant OF THAT FACT.
Where you got the whole notion that you just put forth is rather beyond. me. Anyone who told you that -or who wrote that - is either completely ignorant of how The Constitution works - OR LYING TO YOU.
But Budgets HAVE NO MEANINGFUL EFFECT ON SPENDING.
You really are demonstrating a huge amount of ignorance.
What about Whittaker Chambers has to do with Obama? Chambers was dead by the time Obama was born. Yes the CPUSA supported US Unions... so what?
So your claim that
First off, without government regulation there is no "free market". Because without government protection of private property, or the enforcement of contracts or the prosectuion of fraud, so called "free markets"devolve almost instantly into "might makes right". And since you cannot point to a single regulation that currently exists in the marketplace tht is NOT based in either of the three things I listed, your notion that somehow there is some sort of involuntary coerceion is silly.
As for wealth-transfer. "Wealth transfer" is just that. Transfering weatlh from one person to another. Nothing more, nothing less. Whether it is voluntary or not is irrelevant.
- If I voluntarily enter into a contract, then change my mind, and you sue me for damages, my payment of those damages is clearly coerced and involuntary. And THAT IS WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION
- If I voluntarily enter into a contract that is more profitable for you than for me. that TOO is wealth transfer, regardless of how voluntary it is. THAT IS WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION
- If you have more private property than I do, and we both pay the same amount of taxes to the Government, sicne you get more benefit than I do in property protection. THAT IS WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION
- If someone comes and steals your property, and you cannot prove that it was your property so they get to keep it. THAT IS WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION
- If someone saves money on dump fees and unloads their crap in your yard while you are at work, damaging the value of your property, THAT IS WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION
- If a corporation externalizes the cost of building its product by pollunting your property and you have no recourse, THAT IS WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION
That's simply a basic economic analysis of what "wealth redistribution" is: changing the balance of wealth before and after the transaction. See you want to change "wealth redistribution" to mean "taxes to pay for things you don't want to pay for"... but you know that such a complaint sounds like whining. So you try and disguise it by using the term "Wealth Redistribution ". Except that "wealth redistribution" ALSO includes much of how the so called "free market" works.
As for usurping your labor - your definition here is straight out of Marx. So the Marxist here is you - not me. (that's the irony - most so called "capitalists" who are anti-tax are making the Marxist "fair pay for labor" arguement).
Now since you have no prohibition on moving out of the USA and into any other nation that will have you,, and sine there are clearly nations without the kind of government and regulations that we have in the USA - YOUR PRESENCE HERE, means you are tacitly in voluntary agreement to pay those taxes. Thus there is no "involuntary wealth transfer" going on at all. There may be "wealth transfer" you personally do not think should take place - but that's hardly "involuntary", since you can VOLUNTARILY CHOOSE TO OPT OUT.
The problem of course is that every nation that has the kind of government you advocate - is frankly a sh!thole. And it is a sh!thole mainly because without most of the policies you complain so bitterly about,
- The economic growth slows
- Private property protections are at best lip service
- the "economic friction" costs of protecting your property overwhelms most profit
- the economic friction of corruption runs rampant
- the cost of enforcing contracts is massive
- The safety of individuals is low
And yet that's what you advocate.
Now whether or not we ran on taxes on Commerce exclusively (we did not BTW, the USA sold land, borrowed money, printed money, taxed voting, and collected all manner of fees) is irrelevant. Nothing in ARticle 1 Section 8 precludes taxation of Income. Income taxation preceded Wilson by some 110 years. THE FIRST INCOME TAX WAS PROPOSED BY THE FOUNDING FATHERS as a way to pay for the War of 1812. The first income tax was put into law 50 years later in 1861 fifty two years before Woodrow Wilson.
So even your American History is made up.
First off its not a "belief"... we hav DATA that yse in some cases The Government is more capable of spending an individual's money BETTER than the individual themselves.GDP growth depends on a hell of a lot more than simply tax rates. You would have to be a complete ignoramus to believe higher tax rates promote higher GDP growth because: 1) you would have to believe that the government is more capable of spending an individual's money BETTER than the individual himself is; and 2) the government is more capable of deciding what actions an individual should engage in better than the individual is.
That is a matter of FACTUAL RECORD. It has nothing to do with belief. And since it is a DEMONSTRABLE FACT, the "ignoramous" here is the one of us that is ignorant OF THAT FACT.
WOW talk about Ignorant. This simply is not true First off,Really? The 850 billion dollar stimulus package was not a one time spending increase. It raised the base line spending of the Federal government and has forever been enshrined in each year's federal spending. That's exactly why the Democrat Senate won't pass a budget; they want to keep hiding this dirty little secret.
- A "budget" HAS NO FORCE OF LAW... Budget Bills are POLICY PROPOSALS NOT SPENDING AUTHORIZATIONS
- All spending authorizations/Appropriations BEGIN IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES as required by the Constitution (Article I Section 7 Paragraph 1).
- The American Jobs Recovery Act (AJRA) aka "The stimulus" was a spending APPROPRIATION - and as such It was a one time deal
that is why the deficit has gone down every year after 2009
Where you got the whole notion that you just put forth is rather beyond. me. Anyone who told you that -or who wrote that - is either completely ignorant of how The Constitution works - OR LYING TO YOU.
But Budgets HAVE NO MEANINGFUL EFFECT ON SPENDING.
no there are not the DEFINITION OF SOCIALISM in political and economic theory is very simple. It is Governmental ownership or DIRECT control of the means of production. Nothing More, Nothing Less. Marxism is WORKER ownership of the Means of Production nothing more, nothing less.There are different forms of socialism,And again, where is either Europe or the USA nationalizing any production? Because that's the definition of socialism.
Well you clearly have not been to Europe. Hint, its where they build and drive Ferraris, Porches, Buggatti's and all manner of SuperCars, which can ONLY be afforded if the fruits of production go into capitalistic pockets.in Europe, and in what Obama is trying to inflict on us, rather than own the means of production, they simply confiscate the fruits of that production by taxation.
You really are demonstrating a huge amount of ignorance.
What about Whittaker Chambers has to do with Obama? Chambers was dead by the time Obama was born. Yes the CPUSA supported US Unions... so what?
Name a major fiscal policy (other than the stimulus and the GM bailouts) that is in force today that Obama passed.So, the fact that he's turning this country into a 3rd world Marxist Pigsty should not be surprising to anyone.
So your claim that