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This Is How Trump "Loves" The Military

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
Assad agreed to surrender his WMD arsenal. It is doubtful that Obama would have gotten congressional support for an attack on Syria, so the destruction of those WMDs was really a victory. Assad did not call his bluff.
Since Assad has committed several atrocities with chemical attacks, obviously he didn't destroy his WMD arsenal or capabilities.
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
Since Assad has committed several atrocities with chemical attacks, obviously he didn't destroy his WMD arsenal or capabilities.
As far as I know the attacks since then have been chlorine. Easily purchased. Even mustard gas is something that can be produced from dual use materials.
The real point being you don't know if all his WMDs were destroyed then. Surely you'd agree that the combined intelligence services of our allies and our own would have had some idea of what he had.
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
Cool, but it's not just about calling to fix the VA. The point is we need to

1) Figure out why the model is broken and fix it
2) Figure out what funding is needed to support the fixed model

I support fixing the VA, but I want to find out what's going so badly ... before ... throwing more money at it. No good money after bad
First, the reason it's broken is because, aside from lip-service, most citizens and politicians don't give a shit about vets. Why? Because most of them never served, never wanted to serve and don't know anyone that served. One main problem with ending the draft is both ending that commonality of military service and that military service is becoming more of a family thing. Children of service personnel join the service themselves and far fewer sign up out of the blue. Aside from the wave of patriotism after 9/11, military service has become increasingly cloistered and separate from mainstream Americans. That could turn into a bad thing in another 30-50 years. .

Second, inefficiency is part and parcel of bureaucracies. Improvements can be made but the larger the agency the more inefficient it becomes.
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
As far as I know the attacks since then have been chlorine. Easily purchased. Even mustard gas is something that can be produced from dual use materials.
The real point being you don't know if all his WMDs were destroyed then. Surely you'd agree that the combined intelligence services of our allies and our own would have had some idea of what he had.
Sure, an idea, but it's difficult to get intel inside a brutal dictatorship since the penalty is often brutal and deadly.
 

kaz

Small l libertarian
First, the reason it's broken is because, aside from lip-service, most citizens and politicians don't give a shit about vets. Why? Because most of them never served, never wanted to serve and don't know anyone that served. One main problem with ending the draft is both ending that commonality of military service and that military service is becoming more of a family thing. Children of service personnel join the service themselves and far fewer sign up out of the blue. Aside from the wave of patriotism after 9/11, military service has become increasingly cloistered and separate from mainstream Americans. That could turn into a bad thing in another 30-50 years. .

Second, inefficiency is part and parcel of bureaucracies. Improvements can be made but the larger the agency the more inefficient it becomes.
So you don't know why it's broken either. Fair enough. So let's find out before throwing good money after bad
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
So you don't know why it's broken either. Fair enough. So let's find out before throwing good money after bad
yup, the paralysis of analysis. There are more than one problem. One is there is a long wait to see a doctor....how much thought does it take to know more doctors means less wait?
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
Sure, an idea, but it's difficult to get intel inside a brutal dictatorship since the penalty is often brutal and deadly.
Israel walked off with a warehouse of Iranian documents. I think the Mossad had a pretty good idea of what he had.
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
So you don't know why it's broken either. Fair enough. So let's find out before throwing good money after bad
Translation: [Unwelcome language removed] the VA.

Regardless of your motive, the results are the same as the Democrat: Nothing is done and the vets suffer.
 

EatTheRich

President
Sure, an idea, but it's difficult to get intel inside a brutal dictatorship since the penalty is often brutal and deadly.
I don’t know much about chemical weapons, but my understanding is that most of them can’t be stored for years ... that if they are using effective chemical weapons this year.m, those weapons were almost certainly manufactured this year.
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
I don’t know much about chemical weapons, but my understanding is that most of them can’t be stored for years ... that if they are using effective chemical weapons this year.m, those weapons were almost certainly manufactured this year.
It depends. I"m not an expert either know there's an inverse correlation between the potency of the weapon and it's shelf life which is why tin-plated dictators like the simple stuff: Mustard and chlorine gas.

They might have the major components already produced and then mix the final group just before use.
 

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
You're about 10 sheets in the wind ignorant
af·firm·a·tive ac·tion
/əˈfərmədiv ˈakSHən/
noun
NORTH AMERICAN
  1. (in the context of the allocation of resources or employment) the practice or policy of favoring individuals belonging to groups known to have been discriminated against previously.
 

kaz

Small l libertarian
Translation: [Unwelcome language removed] the VA.

Regardless of your motive, the results are the same as the Democrat: Nothing is done and the vets suffer.
Gotcha, if I don't want to just throw money at the VA, then I hate the VA. That's just stupid
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
Gotcha, if I don't want to just throw money at the VA, then I hate the VA. That's just stupid
You keep refering to the opinions of others as just throwing money at it. That is false. Do you really think the problems are not well known and documented?
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
First, the reason it's broken is because, aside from lip-service, most citizens and politicians don't give a shit about vets. Why? Because most of them never served, never wanted to serve and don't know anyone that served. One main problem with ending the draft is both ending that commonality of military service and that military service is becoming more of a family thing. Children of service personnel join the service themselves and far fewer sign up out of the blue. Aside from the wave of patriotism after 9/11, military service has become increasingly cloistered and separate from mainstream Americans. That could turn into a bad thing in another 30-50 years. .

Second, inefficiency is part and parcel of bureaucracies. Improvements can be made but the larger the agency the more inefficient it becomes.
I don't think it is true that people don't care about vets. Politicians simply find it convenient to cut increases to VA budgets. Even John McCain voted to kill a veterans education bill because he said it made it too easy for guys to leave the service.
Eric Shinseki became the scape goat when he was the one who actually discovered the problem. My congressman makes veterans issues a big deal all the time...not just for elections.
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
Cool, but it's not just about calling to fix the VA. The point is we need to

1) Figure out why the model is broken and fix it
2) Figure out what funding is needed to support the fixed model

I support fixing the VA, but I want to find out what's going so badly ... before ... throwing more money at it. No good money after bad
The current VA was not set up to handle a large influx of new veterans. This has been studied to death and you want to study it some more. Administrators were hiding the waiting list for patients to see specialists.

Looks like Trump went ahead and increased funding...

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2018/07/25/citing_va_reforms_trump_cements_his_bond_with_veterans_137617.html

Do you think he was throwing money at the VA without knowing what he was fixing?
 

EatTheRich

President
You're about 10 sheets in the wind ignorant
af·firm·a·tive ac·tion
/əˈfərmədiv ˈakSHən/
noun
NORTH AMERICAN
  1. (in the context of the allocation of resources or employment) the practice or policy of favoring individuals belonging to groups known to have been discriminated against previously.
Isn’t that why veterans get extra points on job applications? Because they were forced to suffer for the benefit of Wall Street?
 

Max R.

On the road
Supporting Member
Gotcha, if I don't want to just throw money at the VA, then I hate the VA. That's just stupid
You have no interest in supporting the VA or changing anything. I pointed out several problems and your reaction was this:
First, the reason it's broken is because, aside from lip-service, most citizens and politicians don't give a shit about vets. Why? Because most of them never served, never wanted to serve and don't know anyone that served. One main problem with ending the draft is both ending that commonality of military service and that military service is becoming more of a family thing. Children of service personnel join the service themselves and far fewer sign up out of the blue. Aside from the wave of patriotism after 9/11, military service has become increasingly cloistered and separate from mainstream Americans. That could turn into a bad thing in another 30-50 years. .

Second, inefficiency is part and parcel of bureaucracies. Improvements can be made but the larger the agency the more inefficient it becomes.
So you don't know why it's broken either. Fair enough. So let's find out before throwing good money after bad
In short, you're no better that a Yellow-ribbon tying Democrat with no real interest in helping our vets.
 
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