Trump Lies Again About Protecting People With Pre-Existing Conditions

[kaz]

Insurance also works by people paying for risks they take. Sadly, that is largely absent from health insurance.

Your first sentence can be interpreted in multiple ways. Can you clarify what you meant?

 

[ObamacareForever]

Insurance also works by people paying for risks they take. Sadly, that is largely absent from health insurance.

The chances of you getting sick or injured are 100%.

 

[Deleted member 21794]

Your first sentence can be interpreted in multiple ways. Can you clarify what you meant?

Obesity, riding motorcycles, smoking... things like that.

 

[Deleted member 21794]

The chances of you getting sick or injured are 100%.

Are they higher if i ride a motorcycle with no helmet?

And why do I need insurance for routine health issues like the flu or a cold?

 

[ObamacareForever]

Obesity, riding motorcycles, smoking... things like that.

Yes, I totally agree the insurance companies should be able to discriminate more in their pricing.
Right now they are only able to charge more based on age, and smoking.

 

[ObamacareForever]

Are they higher if i ride a motorcycle with no helmet?

On a a short term basis.

And why do I need insurance for routine health issues like the flu or a cold?

Because there is a risk you will need extensive medical care for the flu or a cold.

 

[Deleted member 21794]

On a a short term basis.

Because there is a risk you will need extensive medical care for the flu or a cold.

You are completely lost. Move along now.

 

[kaz]

You're not even making sense.

The individual mandate put the onus on the individual to take responsibility for themselves and buy their own insurance or face the consequences( a fine).

Right, it was a stupid idea. You are saying the objective as if that made it effective. The cost of insurance skyrocketed because of government mandates and it is shitty insurance. Lower classes couldn't afford it and Obama exempted them as well as his buddies from the fine. You're just arguing the leftist solution of saying you state a goal then pretend it worked as designed despite the empirical evidence that says it doesn't

 

[ObamacareForever]

Right, it was a stupid idea. You are saying the objective as if that made it effective. The cost of insurance skyrocketed because of government mandates and it is shitty insurance. Lower classes couldn't afford it and Obama exempted them as well as his buddies from the fine. You're just arguing the leftist solution of saying you state a goal then pretend it worked as designed despite the empirical evidence that says it doesn't

The rates of uninsured dropped under Obama.

 

[kaz]

Nope, I am referring to health insurance.
What are the chances you use health insurance over the long term?
100%, I guarantee you will up sick or injured at some point. Everyone gets sick. By doing away with the individual mandate the government has effectively allowed people to skip out on their medical bills. Instead paying for healthcare on an ex-ante basis through insurance they now just declare bankruptcy on an ex-post basis. Which drives up the prices for responsible people who have insurance.

I was a reasonable person who had insurance, and Obamacare totally screwed me by skyrocketing what I paid for insurance. Obamacare is expensive and has huge deductibles most people can't pay. Most people can't afford to get sick on it and pay the $5-$10K deductible. I can. I already had a high deductible policy I liked. I paid for my own bills. But Obamacare skyrocketed the cost and I have even worse insurance

 

[kaz]

The rates of uninsured dropped under Obama.

And the price of insurance as well as deductibles skyrocketed. People had insurance they couldn't afford to use

 

[ObamacareForever]

I was a reasonable person who had insurance, and Obamacare totally screwed me by skyrocketing what I paid for insurance. Obamacare is expensive and has huge deductibles most people can't pay. Most people can't afford to get sick on it and pay the $5-$10K deductible. I can. I already had a high deductible policy I liked. I paid for my own bills. But Obamacare skyrocketed the cost and I have even worse insurance

how are you quantifying "worse" insurance?

 

[kaz]

how are you quantifying "worse" insurance?

I literally answer that in the post you quoted

 

[ObamacareForever]

I literally answer that in the post you quoted

Your health insurance cost more because it covers more. the healthcare industry didn't stop innovating. Those innovations are life-saving albeit costly.

 

[kaz]

Your health insurance cost more because it covers more. the healthcare industry didn't stop innovating. Those innovations are life-saving albeit costly.

It does not cover more and it pays less. It's a shitty deal. I had insurance before Obamacare, I WAS paying for innovation. That the insured now according to you weren't paying for innovation is just you being full of shit.

This is my point. Obamacare punished the people you admitted were "responsible" and rewarded the people who were not responsible. It's a stupid plan that had the expected crappy results

 

[ObamacareForever]

It does not cover more and it pays less. It's a shitty deal. I had insurance before Obamacare, I WAS paying for innovation. That the insured now according to you weren't paying for innovation is just you being full of shit.

Medical innovations didn't just stop in 2014. Insurance is paying for the risk you will use the those innovations. There is straight up more risk you use those cures/treatments because there are more treatments/cures.

This is my point. Obamacare punished the people you admitted were "responsible" and rewarded the people who were not responsible. It's a stupid plan that had the expected crappy results

No, it forced personal responsibility onto the masses, and it gave assistance to those that neeeded it.

 

[kaz]

Medical innovations didn't just stop in 2014. Insurance is paying for the risk you will use the those innovations. There is straight up more risk you use those cures/treatments because there are more treatments/cures

OK, so healthcare will go up over time. But it went up slowly before to cover those things.

Under obamacare, it's rocketed because of redistribution of wealth and over regulation

No, it forced personal responsibility onto the masses, and it gave assistance to those that neeeded it.

Again, you're pretending it did that. You're pretending it worked. For leftists, that's all that's required. State a plan that you want to implement, claim a goal you want to achieve, then pretend that it happened

 

[Winston]

• 
  

"We will always protect patients with pre-existing conditions, very importantly."

— Donald Trump on Thursday, May 9th, 2019 in comments delivered during a White House event on surprise medical bills

Trump’s talk on preexisting conditions doesn’t match his administration’s actions

Delivering remarks on surprise medical billing, which is a concern that has drawn bipartisan interest, President Donald Trump waded into another high-profile health issue: making sure insurance protects people who have preexisting health conditions.

"We will always protect patients with preexisting conditions, very importantly," Trump said on May 9.

It’s natural Trump would want to make this claim.

Polling from the Kaiser Family Foundation suggests that such protections, which prohibit individual insurance plans from charging people more based on their medical history, are a top priority for Americans and among the most popular provisions of the Affordable Care Act. (KHN is an editorially independent program of the foundation.)

With that context, we decided to put a microscope to the president’s claim.

We asked White House staff to point us to the policies or proposals on which Trump’s statement was based. They declined to provide specifics but reiterated the president’s assertion.

Texas vs. Azar, and a health policy vacuum

Interviews with four separate experts, though, suggested that the administration’s stance on a pending lawsuit that seeks to overturn the Affordable Care Act runs counter to Trump’s claim.

The case, known as Texas vs. Azar, comes from a group of Republican attorneys general who argue that the entire health law should be struck because the 2017 tax bill gutted Obamacare’s requirement to have insurance, often called the individual mandate. In December, a Texas judge agreed.

The case is now before the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals. And, most relevant here, the Department of Justice — that is, the Trump administration’s legal arm — has refused to defend the ACA in these proceedings.

It’s highly unusual for an administration to decline to defend a federal law in court.

"This is a case when the department can make strong arguments in defense of the statute. Refusing to defend in those circumstances is almost unprecedented," said Nicholas Bagley, a law professor at the University of Michigan.

Initially, the Trump administration’s position on the lawsuit focused on the individual mandate, arguing that without it the ACA’s preexisting condition protections should be struck down, too. In filing a brief to the appellate court, though, the DOJ joined the plaintiffs to argue the law should be scrapped entirely. This outcome would also eliminate the law’s protections for people with preexisting health conditions.

In that context, "there is real cause for skepticism" about Trump’s assertion, said Wendy Netter Epstein, a law professor at DePaul University.

And, the GOP bills the White House has supported to date — including the so-called Graham-Cassidy legislation first proposed in 2017, which the administration again endorsed in its 2019 budget proposal — would fall short, multiple experts said.

Unlike the ACA, Graham-Cassidy allows states to redefine which core benefits — a list that includes protections for people with health problems — insurance plans must cover, which would make those protections optional. (For more on Graham-Cassidy, here’s another PolitiFact check from last fall.)

Plus, experts said, even if the White House had a plan, the odds of it gaining passage are slim with a divided Congress.

That makes safeguarding the ACA in court "the only show in town" if the administration is serious about protecting consumers who have preexisting conditions, Bagley said.

Some experts also point out that the administration has issued regulations that run contrary to Trump’s claim. In particular, it recently issued a rule loosening restrictions on the length of so-called short-term health plans, which supporters said would bring a more affordable option to the individual insurance market. But these plans, which, because of the rule change, can last a year instead of three months, are considered bare-bones and are not required to provide preexisting condition protections.

Our ruling
Trump said his administration will "always protect patients with preexisting conditions."

The White House’s policy trajectory does exactly the opposite. The DOJ’s stance, which reflects a policy in place at the same moment the president made this claim, would eliminate the only law guaranteeing that people with preexisting conditions both receive health coverage and do not have to pay more for it.

And on the regulatory front, the administration has advanced a health insurance option that is not required to include these protections.

Furthermore, the administration has not put forth any plan that might keep those guarantees in place. Every replacement health bill it has endorsed has offered protections less generous than those offered by the ACA. And it has taken further steps that could make it harder for people with preexisting conditions to get affordable coverage.

This statement is not accurate and makes a claim in direct opposition of what’s actually happening. We rate it False.

https://www.politifact.com/health-check/statements/2019/may/16/donald-trump/trumps-talk-preexisting-conditions-doesnt-match-hi/?fbclid=IwAR1aPeppmw4OFQCZoaHSWlvXuhfIHHrfLSWOu8yGvmy3ibLrL6D95wGWyAc

How did Trump lie about a healthcare plan that does not exist?

You mean obooba lied right

 

[ObamacareForever]

OK, so healthcare will go up over time. But it went up slowly before to cover those things.

Under obamacare, it's rocketed because of redistribution of wealth and over regulation

The rate of innovation is by no means a steady straight line. There will be pockets of innovations that come and cost a fortune, and there will pockets where it will be slow.

Again, you're pretending it did that. You're pretending it worked. For leftists, that's all that's required. State a plan that you want to implement, claim a goal you want to achieve, then pretend that it happened

It successfully got more people covered.

 

[kaz]

The rate of innovation is by no means a steady straight line. There will be pockets of innovations that come and cost a fortune, and there will pockets where it will be slow

So it turns out that insurance doubled in just a few years after Obamacare, deductibles skyrocketed, care plummeted, but it was just that medical innovation just happened to kick in exactly then and Obamacare's mandates had nothing to do with it.

I learn so much from you. And all of it is wrong

It successfully got more people covered.

Yes, people had medical insurance they couldn't afford to use. Praise Obama!