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Were the Founding Fathers actually Christians?

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
Yes, yes he did.

He also wrote this:


Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.

-Thomas Jefferson, Notes on Virginia, 1782

And?
What's the context of what he wrote? Who was he writing too? Link to where you got the quote. That's the AND part you neglect to add.
 

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
1821 February 27. (Jefferson to Timothy Pickering). "no one sees with greater pleasure than myself the progress of reason in it’s advances towards rational Christianity. when we shall have done away the incomprehensible jargon of the Trinitarian arithmetic, that three are one, and one is three; when we shall have knocked down the artificial scaffolding, reared to mask from view the simple structure of Jesus, when, in short, we shall have unlearned every thing which has been taught since his day, and got back to the pure and simple doctrines he inculcated, we shall then be truly and worthily his disciples: and my opinion is that if nothing had ever been added to what flowed purely from his lips, the whole world would at this day have been Christian.
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
Link name NONBELIEFS? :rolleyes:

Yes...it's a compendium of quotes. So?

Context...

1821 February 27.
(Jefferson to Timothy Pickering). "no one sees with greater pleasure than myself the progress of reason in it’s advances towards rational Christianity. when we shall have done away the incomprehensible jargon of the Trinitarian arithmetic, that three are one, and one is three; when we shall have knocked down the artificial scaffolding, reared to mask from view the simple structure of Jesus, when, in short, we shall have unlearned every thing which has been taught since his day, and got back to the pure and simple doctrines he inculcated, we shall then be truly and worthily his disciples: and my opinion is that if nothing had ever been added to what flowed purely from his lips, the whole world would at this day have been Christian.


I find the general precepts of Christ to be wonderful. Give, forgive, love, take care of others, especially the poor.

What I do not see in any of these claims or comments from Jefferson is that Jesus is God. TJ liked the philosophies Jesus spoke of...even if he didn't come close to living them.
 

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
Yes...it's a compendium of quotes. So?

Context...



I find the general precepts of Christ to be wonderful. Give, forgive, love, take care of others, especially the poor.

What I do not see in any of these claims or comments from Jefferson is that Jesus is God. TJ liked the philosophies Jesus spoke of...even if he didn't come close to living them.
I see what you did playing with words again? Can't win an argument move the goal post. THE DISCUSSION ISN'T ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT JEFFERSONS BELIEVED JESUS WAS GOD, BUT WHETHER THE FOUNDERS INCLUDING JEFFERSON WERE CHRISTIANS
Stop it.
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
I see what you did playing with words again? Can't win an argument move the goal post. THE DISCUSSION ISN'T ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT JEFFERSONS BELIEVED JESUS WAS GOD, BUT WHETHER THE FOUNDERS INCLUDING JEFFERSON WERE CHRISTIANS
Stop it.
Read, deeply...


1821 February 27.
(Jefferson to Timothy Pickering). "no one sees with greater pleasure than myself the progress of reason in it’s advances towards rational Christianity. when we shall have done away the incomprehensible jargon of the Trinitarian arithmetic, that three are one, and one is three; when we shall have knocked down the artificial scaffolding, reared to mask from view the simple structure of Jesus, when, in short, we shall have unlearned every thing which has been taught since his day, and got back to the pure and simple doctrines he inculcated, we shall then be truly and worthily his disciples: and my opinion is that if nothing had ever been added to what flowed purely from his lips, the whole world would at this day have been Christian.


Jefferson liked the philosophy of Christ. This is the world where Jesus is a prophet, not a God.
 

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
Read, deeply...


1821 February 27.
(Jefferson to Timothy Pickering). "no one sees with greater pleasure than myself the progress of reason in it’s advances towards rational Christianity. when we shall have done away the incomprehensible jargon of the Trinitarian arithmetic, that three are one, and one is three; when we shall have knocked down the artificial scaffolding, reared to mask from view the simple structure of Jesus, when, in short, we shall have unlearned every thing which has been taught since his day, and got back to the pure and simple doctrines he inculcated, we shall then be truly and worthily his disciples: and my opinion is that if nothing had ever been added to what flowed purely from his lips, the whole world would at this day have been Christian.


Jefferson liked the philosophy of Christ. This is the world where Jesus is a prophet, not a God.
Stop giving your opinion on a subject you have absolutely no knowledge of. Once again the discussion is not about whether or not Jefferson believe God and Jesus were one but whether the founders Jeffersons included were Christians. You have not yet presented anything to show they were not. So now is your time to bow out.
 

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
@Craig you are doing exactly what Jefferson hated
1823 April 11. (Jefferson to John Adams). "The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them, who have perverted them for the structure of a system of fancy absolutely incomprehensible, and without any foundation in his genuine words. And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away all this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this the most venerated reformer of human errors"
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
@Craig you are doing exactly what Jefferson hated
1823 April 11. (Jefferson to John Adams). "The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them, who have perverted them for the structure of a system of fancy absolutely incomprehensible, and without any foundation in his genuine words. And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away all this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this the most venerated reformer of human errors"
Actually...I believe you have it backwards. Those Jefferson speaks of are folks like Ted Cruz...

The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them...
 

Craig

Senator
Supporting Member
Stop giving your opinion on a subject you have absolutely no knowledge of. Once again the discussion is not about whether or not Jefferson believe God and Jesus were one but whether the founders Jeffersons included were Christians. You have not yet presented anything to show they were not. So now is your time to bow out.
What is a Christian?
 

Constitutional Sheepdog

][][][%er!!!!!!!
Actually...I believe you have it backwards. Those Jefferson speaks of are folks like Ted Cruz...

The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them...
Nope he's speaking of people like you. You have done the very thing in this thread that disgusted him.
 
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