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Don't tread on me

Days

Commentator
You are the one presuming tyranny, not me and your progression is regression.
Ummm to ensure a healthy citizenry? Is that mentally and emotionally healthy? For lockdown isn't ensuring that and lack of Sunshine ain't good for physical health either.
I went to O'Hare yesterday, the busiest airport on the planet... it was empty.
I went to the public park today... it was empty (on a Saturday).

Depression is a terrible thing to live through. Dr. Fauci is finally starting to admit that...

Dave Portnoy unloads on Fauci in blistering rant on ‘Tucker Carlson Tonight’
534,131 views
•Premiered 18 hours ago

The general welfare of the nation; that doesn't mean healthcare, it was not written about health care, it was written about the economy. The general welfare means how everyone is doing in general, it means we are living good, if our welfare is hurting, we donate welfare to those who are hurting. Welfare is not health care, it is money or goods... that could include paying for the doctor visit, but welfare has nothing to do with catching a virus, it means to be doing well financially. The government was set up to insure financial well being and secure the blessings of liberty.
 
that's kind of it....
I would have stated it a little differently;
something more like, it is my opinion of the constitution as it applies to the republic today... so, very much inside the law; aka the rule of law.

Did you know that your ownership of your house is actually a legal opinion of the records held at County? The records themselves are not in and of themselves proof of ownership, ownership actually lies in a professional legal opinion of the records. The constitution is like that. The actual text on paper is not the law of the land, constitutional law is the judicial opinion (interpretation) of the text. That's why lawyers refer to the Supreme Court rulings when they are stating the law. So, the big idea is that it is a living constitution, because it is the ongoing opinion of the Supreme Court that becomes law.

So, in the main, I agree with your point, because I care not for the original intent of the first Amendment (seduce the French people to change their allegiance from the crown to the republic) (and that was the original intent of the writing; remember who wrote it, Robes Pierre's committee wrote it, we just copied it) ... I only care how the amendment is applied to our republic today. And it is my opinion that this current tyrannical law being spouted from my Governor is stepping all over the first Amendment, as it applies to our state law today.
This is why I think you are a unique poster. You think for yourself. While I am not that crazy about your religious posts, you always take posting seriously and have done so for ages. I go back and forth, I simply cannot resist being a jerk every now and then. You remain a constant and that is why I will always like you Days.
 

Days

Commentator
This is why I think you are a unique poster. You think for yourself. While I am not that crazy about your religious posts, you always take posting seriously and have done so for ages. I go back and forth, I simply cannot resist being a jerk every now and then. You remain a constant and that is why I will always like you Days.
you got a friend in me, Wooley. We have a kindred spirit, we understand that economics is just the study of how you live your life and how you spend your energy. I remember run75441 (remember him) always chided me because I can't get the numbers right; he was an advisor to Chinese industry; he always got the numbers right. My son is dyslexic, so is my wife, my bosses, no one gives me the numbers right, how am I supposed to get them right? But I understand the designs, the wonder of it all, and I keep trying to fix it, I keep trying to heal it, I don't really care about the first Amendment, I don't even care if they lock me in my home forever; I'm old now, my walks don't always make it across the street to the park, most times, I just make it to our 2 little ponds, talk with the ducks and the geese... damn those geese are ornery.

where was I? I get lost talking to myself. what are thoughts? Are those like spirits swimming through your mind? Some of us are like the train station at Novi, Michigan... not much there, it was the number 6 stop on the Grand Plank road to Lansing... in Roman numerals, there was a sign at the train stop NoVI ... yeah they named the stupid town after the sign, not much traffic there. Not my mind, my mind is like Grand Central station in NYC or Union Station in Chicago, so many damn voices in my head, I gotta tell 'em all to shut up so I can think... or is that what happens when you think too much? heh

I'm not religious Wooley, I hate religion. I don't go to church, I am the church. Hell, I am the 2nd coming... at least, that spirit is in my head too.


You know, I'm damaged. Not from war, but from society. Things in my head don't always work correctly. I short circuit. burn up. I'm trying to heal that. But I know it will never completely heal. But life is not about the destination, it is about the journey. At the same time, why spend your whole life headed for nowhere? I want to heal the money... I want to heal our lives... I want to heal what is killing our hearts... and what is killing our hearts? Why are we afraid to say "I love you" right out loud? I know why I'm afraid, I have a super jealous wife. I try to hide her from the fray... she is on facebook; she tells me what is happening in the world; I call her Miss Information.

heh, this post did not get lost, it wasn't headed any where to begin with. :)

I was listening to these 2 singing in the background...

Music at The Mansion: Mandolin Orange
439,140 views
•Jun 23, 2019
 
Pictures of the orchids would be nice, growing them successfully is quite the accomplishment.
Ps I don't think that orchid growing is as difficult as it may have been in the past. I am only growing cool and intermediate orchids in my home ( fragrant ones) - no hot house ones. If you are interested I can recommend three good youtubers - Danielle's Orchid Ranch, Rich L ( his illness seems to have got the better of him sadly but he has left us with a lot of knowledge) and Orchid Whisperer. There are others but they are my favs.

Just start with one and go for it xxx
 

RickWA

Snagglesooth
Though constitutionally you have always had freedom of speech, in theory, I know that it was not always so, in practice, for public opinion and or even the gun all through the Vietnam years dictated what people could and could not safely say. That I know from personal experience and yet; in 1968-69 while that war was still raging 100 thousand people in the US died of a flu ( Hong Kong flu it was named). Nothing was closed down and no-one was told to shut up about it, the flu, and 400 thousand people gathered in one place for WoodStock.

What I mean to say is that you are being romantic about your Constitution for by my own observations your freedoms exist only where the true powers that be allow them to exist and disappear where said powers wish them to die. Be it war, economic manipulation and or now sickness that those powers deem their profits to be, Planned ingrained ignorance ( via education) means that those who are aware of the importance of them must say goodbye to all freedoms or be damned one way or another.

Not only in America though Days, if Rick thinks that he can take off and travel the world freely he is in for a shock, The whole of the so called free world is in lockdown. The Islamic world is not and two African countries have rejected it too but then this is not about government this is by the dictate of the true powers that be ----- So who are these powers who can now dictate that the whole world must stay shut up in their homes in the Springtime? That is the question for until we can see plainly who the enemy is we have no hope of fighting them.
Howdy QT! My point, in doing the nomadic thing upon retirement, is that the “tether” to the USA is largely broken for me. Anti-liberty busybodies and control freaks have effectively rendered America alsoran.

Oh, and traveling as I do and have for the past 30 years, I have a pretty good grasp of where I can freely roam. Should be fun. :)

Still a few years out though - my youngest is just a sophomore in HS.
 
Howdy QT! My point, in doing the nomadic thing upon retirement, is that the “tether” to the USA is largely broken for me. Anti-liberty busybodies and control freaks have effectively rendered America alsoran.

Oh, and traveling as I do and have for the past 30 years, I have a pretty good grasp of where I can freely roam. Should be fun. :)

Still a few years out though - my youngest is just a sophomore in HS.
'Alsoran' lol I have to look up some of your words.

My father used to do that in his diatribes - 'what did you say (mean)?'

Good word though :)

I know that you know the world but fings are a changing all over :(
 

RickWA

Snagglesooth
'Alsoran' lol I have to look up some of your words.

My father used to do that in his diatribes - 'what did you say (mean)?'

Good word though :)

I know that you know the world but fings are a changing all over :(
Yep. The world always changes - and usually not for the better. Many countries seek retirement/expat dollars though. Geeze, the last time I was in the south of Portugal you’d swear you were in England. So it is with much of the south Mediterranean coast of Spain. Don’t get me started on SE Asia, Belize, etc. There are still many options so long as one can prove financial means.

At any rate, it was less about actual retirement plans than it was about my disgust for where we’re headed. It would be far more tolerable if so many of my fellow rank and file citizens weren’t enthusiastically PARTICIPATING in our own demise.
 
Yep. The world always changes - and usually not for the better. Many countries seek retirement/expat dollars though. Geeze, the last time I was in the south of Portugal you’d swear you were in England. So it is with much of the south Mediterranean coast of Spain. Don’t get me started on SE Asia, Belize, etc. There are still many options so long as one can prove financial means.

At any rate, it was less about actual retirement plans than it was about my disgust for where we’re headed. It would be far more tolerable if so many of my fellow rank and file citizens weren’t enthusiastically PARTICIPATING in our own demise.
I feel exactly the same about England, darling.
 

reason10

Governor
In all this craziness of this shut down, there is something that somehow remains fuzzy, something just isn't right, and no one is saying it out loud, we are getting snookered, and we know it, but we can't figure out exactly how. So let me say this straight out. This shut down is flat out illegal, it is point blank against the Constitution, it is outright tyranny, and it is our patriotic duty to revolt against it.

The Constitution was amended with this writ of rights that came straight from France. We have Robes Pierre - of all people - to thank for our Bill of Rights. Who was Robes Pierre? He was the world's first terrorist. Robes Pierre terrorized the nation of France to force it to give up their king and accept the new republic. In so doing, he wrote the people a list of rights they would enjoy under the new republic. A politician's politician, you might say.

Now the very first right of the people living under the republic - and therefore the most important right we have - is the right to free speech; this includes freedom of the press and freedom to assemble for purposes of worship or to protest the government. All of that is your freedom of speech.

When we sing "land of the freeeeeeeeee" ... we are singing about the first Amendment. When we sing, "I'm proud to be an American, where, at least, I know I'm free..." we are singing about the first Amendment prohibiting Congress from making any law that takes away our freedom of speech.

Government can not take away our freedom in this republic. The republic was set up under the strict prohibition of making any law that takes away our freedom; IOW, if some Governor proclaims he/she has outlawed your freedom for any reason, that Governor is no longer a Governor, he/she has zero authority the moment he/she does that, because he/she has gone outside of the republic, where he/she is just another blow hard, all the authority of being a Governor is contained within the Constitution and their abiding within that framework of law. That's why they take an oath of office to defend the Constitution, not defend their political party, not defend the people, but defend the Constitution... all the power of their office is given by the Constitution.

So, this is an illegal lock down and we the people are not under any such law, this is the equivalent of a military officer giving an illegal order in the field, you actually are in trouble if you obey that order, we are not supposed to carry out illegal orders. Now the corner grocery store can legally require me to wear a mask if I want to shop there, that is their prerogative, but the Governor can not order me to stay at home or not go to church or not protest his tyrannical edicts. In Illinois, the county sheriffs are refusing to carry out the Governor's illegal orders, they do that because they understand better than to carry out illegal commands. It is a sad state of affairs that the common people do not have that understanding, but we are starting to figure it out.

The con job is the use of the pandemic as a state of emergency and the strange act of trying to place a quarantine on healthy people. Already something should not feel right about that. But it doesn't matter what the real death rate is or whether hospitals are over whelmed with patients, none of that matters, the government can not tread on the first Amendment for any reason and not for any amount of time. The Amendment prohibits the emergence of a law that takes away our freedom, let alone allowing such a law to emerge, take hold, and take away our freedoms for a specific amount of time. The moment the Governor of Illinois announced his lock down and stay at home order was the moment he stepped outside the Constitution and his oath to defend it and until he returns to that, he is not my Governor, he is just another pretender to power that he doesn't have. We the people should ignore him and we are slowly realizing that.

This is cut and dry tyranny. What is tyranny? That's when your Governor attempts to take away your freedom, that's what tyranny means. This is not tolerable, not for one moment in time, not ever for any reason, it is prohibited under the first Amendment, and it is absolute, it is not okay for this to happen, do not allow these pretenders to tread on your freedom, they have no authority whatsoever to do that.
You make a lot of valid points.

Gotta admit, I hadn't thought of Robespierre in terms of rights and a republic as a form of government. (For those who are wondering, Robespierre was an after product of the French Revolution of 1792-94.) The common folk of France were rebelling against the Noble class and the Monarchy, hence the fall of the Bastille. Robespierre was one of those common folk in the revolution who took it to the extreme and committed mass murder.

It's no surprise that Illinois would take a match to the Constitution. What should bother you more than the Governor's actions is the fact that he did not shoot his way into power. Enough people who agreed with him voted him into that office. And barring some sex crime or other charges, the kind of which cost Governor Cuomo his office, your governor will probably be reelected.

It is no accident that the early advertisement for Socialism (The Jungle, by Upton Sinclair) took place in Chicago.
 

reason10

Governor
Meh. As I noted, Americans went through this in 1918 and everything went back to normal when the virus receded. We'll get through this and no one will die of having skipped a haircut or church service. Wearing masks never hurt anyone and it gives you solidarity with your fellow citizens who show their concern for your life even as you show your concern for theirs. You've never been able to "do as you please" (try going to the park naked sometime) and these measures are temporary (as you noted - there's no law on the books). We each need to suck it up and behave as though we actually do love our fellow man rather than just saying we do.
Of course this is going to really date me, (as an educated old fart) but I can remember much worse times in America than this epidemic. I saw the legislated Jim Crow segregation of lunch counters. I remember the Vietnam War draft, (which had high school seniors quaking in their boots.) I remember the race riots in major cities, the long gas lines of the early Seventies.

A wise (and older) gent once told me that if this is the worst thing that will happen to you in life, you're pretty lucky.
 
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