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One more sex perv outed...this time the governor of NY

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
Since you divert to socialism - is SOCIAL Security socialism - the program so many use nowadays
i didnt divert...he started his i post facts baloney.. everybody that reads his posts knows thats all he talks about...socialism.

anyway... yes SS is, but not in the sense of marxist theory
 

EatTheRich

President
oh, do tell...whistful pining for socialism is not fact.
Pointing out that E. Germany, Czechoslovakia, and N. Korea were the first countries to end, respectively, homelessness, polio, and illiteracy is not "wistful pining for socialism." It's just fact. You just don't want to discuss the SPECIFICS of the facts if they make socialism, "in the sense of Marxist theory," look good. So you deflect to an abstraction that means anything and everything from Cuba's Operation Miracle to Canadian medical care to the U.S.'s Social Security program to German Nazism.
 

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
Pointing out that E. Germany, Czechoslovakia, and N. Korea were the first countries to end, respectively, homelessness, polio, and illiteracy is not "wistful pining for socialism." It's just fact. You just don't want to discuss the SPECIFICS of the facts if they make socialism, "in the sense of Marxist theory," look good. So you deflect to an abstraction that means anything and everything from Cuba's Operation Miracle to Canadian medical care to the U.S.'s Social Security program to German Nazism.
Yes..not to mention iron curtains, subjugation, forced compliance, and malnutrition..

Which glorious specifics of socialism have you raised in the past for discussion? Did you raise saban's vaccine field trials? No. Big deal, checkoslovakia conducted Mass Field trials with attenuated virus on its child population, luckily with success, during a time that the world was racing to end polio epidemic. Doesn't change the fact that they were subjugated under communist role for decades and decades and utterly beholden to that role
 

EatTheRich

President
Yes..not to mention iron curtains, subjugation, forced compliance, and malnutrition..

Which glorious specifics of socialism have you raised in the past for discussion? Did you raise saban's vaccine field trials? No. Big deal, checkoslovakia conducted Mass Field trials with attenuated virus on its child population, luckily with success, during a time that the world was racing to end polio epidemic. Doesn't change the fact that they were subjugated under communist role for decades and decades and utterly beholden to that role
There’s a reason Czechoslovakia and not, say, the U.S. did it. 1) Sabin had to conduct his research in the Soviet Union due to a lack of intellectual freedom in the United States. 2) The ideologies needed to maintain capitalist rule fostered anti-science, superstitious attitudes that led to suspicion of vaccines. 3) Czechoslovakia’s state-run health care system more efficiently delivered care than the U.S.’s hodgepodge of private providers.

Was Czechoslovakia one of many repressive bureaucratic Stalinist dictatorships? By all means. They didn’t have much malnutrition though. In fact, over more than 100 years of socialism, you saw perhaps 10 years of malnutrition in the Soviet Union and its constituent republics, another 10 in China, and perhaps 15 in N. Korea. During the same years, there were more than 30 years of malnutrition in prerevolutionary capitalist China and 100 years in capitalist India … but of course you blame socialism when a socialist country (more rarely than you acknowledge) relapses into the barbarism that is typical of the capitalist world.
 

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
There’s a reason Czechoslovakia and not, say, the U.S. did it. 1) Sabin had to conduct his research in the Soviet Union due to a lack of intellectual freedom in the United States. 2) The ideologies needed to maintain capitalist rule fostered anti-science, superstitious attitudes that led to suspicion of vaccines. 3) Czechoslovakia’s state-run health care system more efficiently delivered care than the U.S.’s hodgepodge of private providers.

Was Czechoslovakia one of many repressive bureaucratic Stalinist dictatorships? By all means. They didn’t have much malnutrition though. In fact, over more than 100 years of socialism, you saw perhaps 10 years of malnutrition in the Soviet Union and its constituent republics, another 10 in China, and perhaps 15 in N. Korea. During the same years, there were more than 30 years of malnutrition in prerevolutionary capitalist China and 100 years in capitalist India … but of course you blame socialism when a socialist country (more rarely than you acknowledge) relapses into the barbarism that is typical of the capitalist world.
Sabin was buttressed by the import of vaccines from the West, from Eli Lilly and the like... And it wasn't because of intellectual freedom, it was because of the lack of limitation as it relates experimentation that allowed him to conduct massive field trials on the children of Czechoslovakia, which luckily turned out okay..
 

EatTheRich

President
Sabin was buttressed by the import of vaccines from the West, from Eli Lilly and the like... And it wasn't because of intellectual freedom, it was because of the lack of limitation as it relates experimentation that allowed him to conduct massive field trials on the children of Czechoslovakia, which luckily turned out okay..
No. The R&D was done in the Soviet Union before any thought was given to human trials, because the U.S. obstructed Sabin based on his ethnicity and political views.
 
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PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
No. The R&D was done in the Soviet Union before any thought was given to human trials, because the U.S.
Ok but no. I thought I read that the east and west were collaborating and that US companies were sending vaccine over...until Moscow finished it's development of live attenuated polio vax...
 

EatTheRich

President
Ok but no. I thought I read that the east and west were collaborating and that US companies were sending vaccine over...until Moscow finished it's development of live attenuated polio vax...
Sure, the Soviets and their allies imported the Salk vaccine. For which they paid through the nose with food exports to the U.S., for something the developer wanted to be free. Call that collaboration if you wish.
 

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
Sure, the Soviets and their allies imported the Salk vaccine. For which they paid through the nose with food exports to the U.S., for something the developer wanted to be free. Call that collaboration if you wish.
Yes. An exchange...that is how it works
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
There’s a reason Czechoslovakia and not, say, the U.S. did it. 1) Sabin had to conduct his research in the Soviet Union due to a lack of intellectual freedom in the United States. 2) The ideologies needed to maintain capitalist rule fostered anti-science, superstitious attitudes that led to suspicion of vaccines. 3) Czechoslovakia’s state-run health care system more efficiently delivered care than the U.S.’s hodgepodge of private providers.

Was Czechoslovakia one of many repressive bureaucratic Stalinist dictatorships? By all means. They didn’t have much malnutrition though. In fact, over more than 100 years of socialism, you saw perhaps 10 years of malnutrition in the Soviet Union and its constituent republics, another 10 in China, and perhaps 15 in N. Korea. During the same years, there were more than 30 years of malnutrition in prerevolutionary capitalist China and 100 years in capitalist India … but of course you blame socialism when a socialist country (more rarely than you acknowledge) relapses into the barbarism that is typical of the capitalist world.
Most of Sabin's work was in the US. It was financed by the US government. He was a US citizen and had been an officer in the US army.
 
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