Clean Solar Energy

[Zam-Zam]

It may not be as 'clean' as we are being lead to believe:

Behind the Rise of U.S. Solar Power, a Mountain of Chinese Coal

Reliance on coal-fired electricity to produce solar panels raises concerns in the West


Solar panel installations are surging in the U.S. and Europe as Western countries seek to cut their reliance on fossil fuels.

But the West faces a conundrum as it installs panels on small rooftops and in sprawling desert arrays: Most of them are produced with energy from carbon-dioxide-belching, coal-burning plants in China.

Concerns are mounting in the U.S. and Europe that the solar industry’s reliance on Chinese coal will create a big increase in emissions in the coming years as manufacturers rapidly scale up production of solar panels to meet demand. That would make the solar industry one of the world’s most prolific polluters, analysts say, undermining some of the emissions reductions achieved from widespread adoption.

For years, China’s low-cost, coal-fired electricity has given the country’s solar-panel manufacturers a competitive advantage, allowing them to dominate global markets.


Complete text: Behind the Rise of U.S. Solar Power, a Mountain of Chinese Coal - WSJ


The more you know, etc.

 

[middleview]

It may not be as 'clean' as we are being lead to believe:

Behind the Rise of U.S. Solar Power, a Mountain of Chinese Coal

Reliance on coal-fired electricity to produce solar panels raises concerns in the West


Solar panel installations are surging in the U.S. and Europe as Western countries seek to cut their reliance on fossil fuels.

But the West faces a conundrum as it installs panels on small rooftops and in sprawling desert arrays: Most of them are produced with energy from carbon-dioxide-belching, coal-burning plants in China.

Concerns are mounting in the U.S. and Europe that the solar industry’s reliance on Chinese coal will create a big increase in emissions in the coming years as manufacturers rapidly scale up production of solar panels to meet demand. That would make the solar industry one of the world’s most prolific polluters, analysts say, undermining some of the emissions reductions achieved from widespread adoption.

For years, China’s low-cost, coal-fired electricity has given the country’s solar-panel manufacturers a competitive advantage, allowing them to dominate global markets.


Complete text: Behind the Rise of U.S. Solar Power, a Mountain of Chinese Coal - WSJ


The more you know, etc.

Do you honestly think that the reason Chinese panels are cheaper than US panels is due to their use of coal fired plants?

In the first place, the panel will save many times the amount of electricity used to make it. Secondly, the Chinese panels are cheap is due to government subsidy. Too bad Trump did not choose to look at that and try to level the playing field.

I got my panels from Solar City and paid a little more to have US made panels.

 

[Zam-Zam]

Do you honestly think that the reason Chinese panels are cheaper than US panels is due to their use of coal fired plants?

?

I'm confused...Did I make such a claim?

The reason Chinese solar panels are relatively cheap is that they are made in China, where labor is dirt cheap.

And, in China, they use coal-fired plants to make them. As a result:


Carbon footprint from Chinese solar panels twice the size of those made in Europe

Solar panels made in China result in twice as much greenhouse gas as those produced in Europe, with lack of environmental standards blamed


Source: Carbon footprint from Chinese solar panels twice the size of those made in Europe | South China Morning Post (scmp.com)

And China makes a lot of solar panels, many of which are sold in the US.




Source: China's lead in the global solar race - at a glance | World Economic Forum (weforum.org)

Something the American consumer should be informed about, no?

So, what's the beef?

 

[middleview]

?

I'm confused...Did I make such a claim?

The reason Chinese solar panels are relatively cheap is that they are made in China, where labor is dirt cheap.

And, in China, they use coal-fired plants to make them. As a result:


Carbon footprint from Chinese solar panels twice the size of those made in Europe

Solar panels made in China result in twice as much greenhouse gas as those produced in Europe, with lack of environmental standards blamed


Source: Carbon footprint from Chinese solar panels twice the size of those made in Europe | South China Morning Post (scmp.com)

And China makes a lot of solar panels, many of which are sold in the US.


View attachment 64544

Source: China's lead in the global solar race - at a glance | World Economic Forum (weforum.org)

Something the American consumer should be informed about, no?

So, what's the beef?

The link you provided did attempt to make the case that the chinese coal fired plants were the reason they were cheaper.

Chinese government subsidies are why it is so hard to compete on panels. From what I read when I got mine, panels are not labor intensive...it is the materials to make them that drive the cost up.

Solar Manufacturing Cost Analysis

www.nrel.gov

 

[Zam-Zam]

The link you provided did attempt to make the case that the chinese coal fired plants were the reason they were cheaper.

Chinese government subsidies are why it is so hard to compete on panels. From what I read when I got mine, panels are not labor intensive...it is the materials to make them that drive the cost up.

Solar Manufacturing Cost Analysis

www.nrel.gov

It seems multiple factors, and not a single one, may be the most correct answer:

In recent years Chinese manufacturers have come to dominate world output in solar panels and components. The conventional wisdom within the renewable energy sector, until recently, was that China had taken over the market because its companies were more efficient, with better automation and more reliable supply chains.

But events over the last few months make clear that there have been some other factors working in China’s favor: cheap coal, heavy Chinese government subsidies allowing for the dumping of solar panels on foreign markets, and the use of forced labor in conditions described as “genocide” and “slavery.”....

And the Chinese government itself attributes its cheap solar panels to cheap energy supplies, from coal. “Over the past decade,” wrote a reporter for the web site, Global Times, which is a mouthpiece for the Chinese government, “Xinjiang has become a major polysilicon production hub in China, as the industry requires extensive amounts of energy, and that makes relatively cheaper electricity and abundant thermal power in Xinjiang appealing.”


...In other words, China made solar panels cheap with coal, subsidies, and “slave” labor, not efficiency. Why is that?

Solar’s Dark Side

Solar panel advocates have long described the technology as innovative, but the dominant commercial solar panels today are the same crystalline silicon panels that Bell Labs developed in the 1950s. And patents for solar panels peaked in 2010, right as the Chinese were cornering the global market.

And against the picture of robots doing all the work, a new report finds that, “Manual laborers at Hoshine's Xinjiang facility are paid to crush silicon manually at a rate of 42 Chinese yuan (around $6.50) per ton.”

While some have suggested that the production of iPhones is as brutal as the production of solar panels, it’s simply not the case. Workers in iPhone factories are not choosing to be there as an alternative to being in concentration camps.

Consider Hoshine, the biggest producer of metallurgical-grade silicon in the world. It is the primary material that is sold to the polysilicon makers. Hoshine’s factory, notes CNN, “holds two facilities that have been identified as detention centers for the ‘re-education’ of Uyghur people.”




Complete text: China Helped Make Solar Power Cheap Through Subsidies, Coal And Allegedly, Forced Labor (forbes.com)

 

[Zam-Zam]

Additional food for thought, via Harvard Business Review:

The Dark Side of Solar Power

The Dark Side of Solar Power (hbr.org)


No free lunch indeed.

 

[middleview]

Additional food for thought, via Harvard Business Review:

The Dark Side of Solar Power

The Dark Side of Solar Power (hbr.org)


No free lunch indeed.

Much like the factory making consummer electronics where so many workers jumped off of the roof of the dorm that they put nets on the second floor.