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None for you?

RickWA

Senator
Right, but the income tax brackets have not changed, nor have any loopholes been eliminated.
You said you have some education in finance, right? And you affirmed in another thread that government does not produce or earn money (in fact, you wrote that it isn't government's job to do so - and I agree). So...when government spends, it IS taxation. When government increases spending, it is increasing taxation - whether deferred or otherwise. Unless you think money magically appears...
 
You said you have some education in finance, right? And you affirmed in another thread that government does not produce or earn money (in fact, you wrote that it isn't government's job to do so - and I agree). So...when government spends, it IS taxation. When government increases spending, it is increasing taxation - whether deferred or otherwise. Unless you think money magically appears...
Deferred till when?
If it is deferred till after I die, I don't care.
 

RickWA

Senator
Deferred till when?
If it is deferred till after I die, I don't care.
Irrelevant. It is still taxation. You claimed that it is not. While we all know entitlement and narcissism when we see it…one must affirm that things exist irrespective of impact of those things on a given individual. Sounds like you were some odd philosophy major rather than finance, econ, business, or ANY of the actual sciences. You’ve entered bearded manbun territory.
 
Irrelevant. It is still taxation. You claimed that it is not. While we all know entitlement and narcissism when we see it…one must affirm that things exist irrespective of impact of those things on a given individual. Sounds like you were some odd philosophy major rather than finance, econ, business, or ANY of the actual sciences. You’ve entered bearded manbun territory.
Taxes=money I owe the government
Student loans= money I owe the government.
Therefore by virtue of the transitive property student loans are taxes.

Therefore student loan forgiveness is a giant tax break for me.
 

TBLee

Governor
“ If you are in a traditional (defined benefit) pension plan, with promised benefits, some of your benefits may be insured by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC), a Federal Government corporation. If a defined benefit plan is terminated because an employer has financial difficulty and cannot fund the plan, and the plan does not have enough money to pay the promised benefits, the PBGC will assume responsibility for the plan. The PBGC pays benefits after termination up to a certain maximum guaranteed amount.”
Plus PPA and VPA aren’t at risk no matter what. Plus knowing the actual pension is PBGC backed is a plus. . Our retirement income is from a major worldwide company. I have confidence in the ability for the Company to maintain its status.
 

EatTheRich

President
“ If you are in a traditional (defined benefit) pension plan, with promised benefits, some of your benefits may be insured by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC), a Federal Government corporation. If a defined benefit plan is terminated because an employer has financial difficulty and cannot fund the plan, and the plan does not have enough money to pay the promised benefits, the PBGC will assume responsibility for the plan. The PBGC pays benefits after termination up to a certain maximum guaranteed amount.”
Plus PPA and VPA aren’t at risk no matter what. Plus knowing the actual pension is PBGC backed is a plus. . Our retirement income is from a major worldwide company. I have confidence in the ability for the Company to maintain its status.
So in some cases taxpayers relieve the employers of responsibility for paying their debts, which you find acceptable.
 

TBLee

Governor
So in some cases taxpayers relieve the employers of responsibility for paying their debts, which you find acceptable.
Nah….that is what happens when a company files for Chapter 7. By the way you really didn’t address my post.
PBGC is an insurance plan. Companies pay insurance premiums I made very clear that I have NO concerns about losing our pension., PPA or VPA because of the status, and size of our past employer. It is all good. I spent most of my adult life working toward a comfortable retirement.
 

EatTheRich

President
Nah….that is what happens when a company files for Chapter 7. By the way you really didn’t address my post.
PBGC is an insurance plan. Companies pay insurance premiums I made very clear that I have NO concerns about losing our pension., PPA or VPA because of the status, and size of our past employer. It is all good. I spent most of my adult life working toward a comfortable retirement.
My concern was not for your household finances. It was about the histrionics we see when pauperized graduates are provided a bit of relief from soul-crushing debt, vs. the “what can you do” attitude when corporations’ billionaire investors are allowed to ignore the promises of the management they hired at the expense of taxpayers or, sometimes, workers.
 

TBLee

Governor
My concern was not for your household finances. It was about the histrionics we see when pauperized graduates are provided a bit of relief from soul-crushing debt, vs. the “what can you do” attitude when corporations’ billionaire investors are allowed to ignore the promises of the management they hired at the expense of taxpayers or, sometimes, workers.
I believe IF you borrow money, you pay it back. Period. That includes my own kids. It is their debt, and no one else should be responsible for paying off their loan.
 

EatTheRich

President
I believe IF you borrow money, you pay it back. Period. That includes my own kids. It is their debt, and no one else should be responsible for paying off their loan.
And if a company owes money to workers with pensions, it should pay them back as well, even if investors have to dip into their personal assets to cover the company’s shortfall? Why or why not?
 

TBLee

Governor
And if a company owes money to workers with pensions, it should pay them back as well, even if investors have to dip into their personal assets to cover the company’s shortfall? Why or why not?
Do you not see a difference between individuals who take a loan, sign a legal document agreeing to pay back the amount THEY borrowed? Pension money is not borrowed it is owed. Investors have to dip into their personal assets to cover the company shortfall? So are you saying investors pay the pensions? I can you give me an example of investors being responsible for a companies pension plan? Student loans and a companies pension plan are two totally different things. Like I said, I am not concerned at all that anyone else will be paying our pension.
 

EatTheRich

President
Do you not see a difference between individuals who take a loan, sign a legal document agreeing to pay back the amount THEY borrowed? Pension money is not borrowed it is owed. Investors have to dip into their personal assets to cover the company shortfall? So are you saying investors pay the pensions? I can you give me an example of investors being responsible for a companies pension plan? Student loans and a companies pension plan are two totally different things. Like I said, I am not concerned at all that anyone else will be paying our pension.
Companies sign a legal agreement with their workers and often the unions representing them agreeing to make those payments. And, no, I can’t give you examples of investors being required to make good on the promises they used to enrich themselves, because we live in a society built around giving employers and creditors every benefit of the doubt at the expense of debtors and employees.
 

TBLee

Governor
Companies sign a legal agreement with their workers and often the unions representing them agreeing to make those payments. And, no, I can’t give you examples of investors being required to make good on the promises they used to enrich themselves, because we live in a society built around giving employers and creditors every benefit of the doubt at the expense of debtors and employees.
So, you don’t even know IF that has happened? Yet, you use that as a catalyst for the acceptance of those who signed a legal document, borrowed money for their personal use and now have no intention of paying back that money and expect you and I to pay off THEIR debt.
 

EatTheRich

President
So, you don’t even know IF that has happened? Yet, you use that as a catalyst for the acceptance of those who signed a legal document, borrowed money for their personal use and now have no intention of paying back that money and expect you and I to pay off THEIR debt.
I’m saying that if this were a society without class exploitation, there would be no such unequal treatment of equal situations. But since we live in a capitalist society, the same government that will hound borrowers to the ends of the earth to pay what they owe their lenders will actively oppose attempts by employees to recover what they are owed by their employers.
 
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