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Selling coffee too hard? Or .. Selling coffee too hard!!

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
Again, you always go to the ad hominem because you want to pretend that my issue with capitalism is my personal situation and not the starving millions whose deprivation is needed to make capitalism possible.
What does that have to do with the difference between the market value of the employees’ contribution and the remuneration of the employee?
There are starving millions irrespective of capitalism. Mostly amongst those upon whom the first world depends on to fuel it's largesse..

The market value is more or less correct.
 

Zam-Zam

Senator
Cuba’s worst year for human rights in decades, as the revolution finally seems to have stopped progressing. Contrast your type case for freedom under capitalism.

Baloney:

Cuba: Fidel Castro’s Record of Repression


(Washington, DC) – During his nearly five decades of rule in Cuba, Fidel Castro built a repressive system that punished virtually all forms of dissent, a dark legacy that lives on even after his death.

During Castro’s rule, thousands of Cubans were incarcerated in abysmal prisons, thousands more were harassed and intimidated, and entire generations were denied basic political freedoms. Cuba made improvements in health and education, though many of these gains were undermined by extended periods of economic hardship and by repressive policies.


Cuba: Fidel Castro’s Record of Repression | Human Rights Watch (hrw.org)

Communism's history of oppression cannot be whitewashed.
 

Number_58

Mayor
Oh, and PS.. marketplace exchanges aren't supposed to be equal. Principally because of the employees fractional contribution. Hope this helps.
This one feels awful sorry for himself. Funny how millions of people less educated than him have a whole lot more...because they go to work and invest their money...rather than being lazy layabouts, whining about the man keeping him down...
 

EatTheRich

President
There are starving millions irrespective of capitalism. Mostly amongst those upon whom the first world depends on to fuel it's largesse..

The market value is more or less correct.
No. Starvation was episodic and caused by circumstance prior to capitalism. It is systematic and deliberate under capitalism. It is vanishing and vestigial under socialism. And it will be absent in the communist future.

The existence of a “first world” (imperialist world) that systematically preys on the colonial/semicolonial world is in fact an artifact of capitalism.

The wages system is inherently exploitative, since no one would hire a wage laborer unless they expect the value produced by the laborer to be more than the value exchanged for the labor,
 

EatTheRich

President
This one feels awful sorry for himself. Funny how millions of people less educated than him have a whole lot more...because they go to work and invest their money...rather than being lazy layabouts, whining about the man keeping him down...
More ad hominem attacks. If I were one of the wealthy millions (out of billions) you’d call me a hypocrite for attacking the system that put me there. The end result is that no one, rich or struggling, is allowed to criticize the system.

What’s more, the average wage is by the laws of supply and demand equal to the amount needed to keep a worker in accustomed (read: avoiding extreme privation according to the standards of the community, e.g., having electricity, heat, a phone, running water, and a fridge for someone in the U.S.) circumstances without gaining or losing wealth. For a few to be able to save means that others make below this subsistence wage. And this is inevitable under capitalism no matter how hard everyone works (which is much harder, in terms of productivity, than any previous generation).
 

EatTheRich

President
Baloney:

Cuba: Fidel Castro’s Record of Repression


(Washington, DC) – During his nearly five decades of rule in Cuba, Fidel Castro built a repressive system that punished virtually all forms of dissent, a dark legacy that lives on even after his death.

During Castro’s rule, thousands of Cubans were incarcerated in abysmal prisons, thousands more were harassed and intimidated, and entire generations were denied basic political freedoms. Cuba made improvements in health and education, though many of these gains were undermined by extended periods of economic hardship and by repressive policies.


Cuba: Fidel Castro’s Record of Repression | Human Rights Watch (hrw.org)

Communism's history of oppression cannot be whitewashed.
Castro’s “record of repression”: “thousands of Cubans … incarcerated” over nearly 5 decades. U.S. … millions of people incarcerated at any given time.
 

Number_58

Mayor
More ad hominem attacks. If I were one of the wealthy millions (out of billions) you’d call me a hypocrite for attacking the system that put me there. The end result is that no one, rich or struggling, is allowed to criticize the system.

What’s more, the average wage is by the laws of supply and demand equal to the amount needed to keep a worker in accustomed (read: avoiding extreme privation according to the standards of the community, e.g., having electricity, heat, a phone, running water, and a fridge for someone in the U.S.) circumstances without gaining or losing wealth. For a few to be able to save means that others make below this subsistence wage. And this is inevitable under capitalism no matter how hard everyone works (which is much harder, in terms of productivity, than any previous generation).
Nice cut and paste, but you're still whining and crying about how horrible your life is and how it's impossible for you to get ahead in life rather than working.
 

EatTheRich

President
Nice cut and paste, but you're still whining and crying about how horrible your life is and how it's impossible for you to get ahead in life rather than working.
Not a cut and paste, and you’re the ones who started about my personal life while I was discussing political and economic facts.
 

Number_58

Mayor
Not a cut and paste, and you’re the ones who started about my personal life while I was discussing political and economic facts.
Your "political and economic facts" are directly related to your personal life. You can't show a successful implementation of socialism nor communism. Everything you base your opinion on is opinion.

Show us a successful implementation of anything, at all, that you espouse.
 

EatTheRich

President
Your "political and economic facts" are directly related to your personal life. You can't show a successful implementation of socialism nor communism. Everything you base your opinion on is opinion.

Show us a successful implementation of anything, at all, that you espouse.
And to the personal lives of everyone in the world. I’m talking about reality, here. The broad sweep of history.

If making people live longer doesn’t qualify as success, what does?
 

Dawg

President
Supporting Member
More ad hominem attacks. If I were one of the wealthy millions (out of billions) you’d call me a hypocrite for attacking the system that put me there. The end result is that no one, rich or struggling, is allowed to criticize the system.

What’s more, the average wage is by the laws of supply and demand equal to the amount needed to keep a worker in accustomed (read: avoiding extreme privation according to the standards of the community, e.g., having electricity, heat, a phone, running water, and a fridge for someone in the U.S.) circumstances without gaining or losing wealth. For a few to be able to save means that others make below this subsistence wage. And this is inevitable under capitalism no matter how hard everyone works (which is much harder, in terms of productivity, than any previous generation).
So why is American known as the FAT country?
Stop whining and go to work
 

Number_58

Mayor
And to the personal lives of everyone in the world. I’m talking about reality, here. The broad sweep of history.

If making people live longer doesn’t qualify as success, what does?
Total dodge. Tell us one place socialism or communism has been implemented where their people are better off than people in the US. You can't.

Successful socialism is a fantasy. It's a Utopian dream. I don't understand why you stay in the US's oppressive capitalist structure. There are socialist havens you can escape to that aren't far away and live out the remainder of your life in happiness. Why not go to one of those countries of milk and honey?
 
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EatTheRich

President
So why is American known as the FAT country?
Stop whining and go to work
Because on the one hand the U.S. is one of a minority of countries made wealthy by the extreme impoverishment of other countries, while on the other hand many still can’t afford nutritious food.
 

EatTheRich

President
Total dodge. Tell us one place socialism or communism has been implemented where their people are better off than people in the US. You can't.

Successful socialism is a fantasy. It's a Utopian dream. I don't understand why you stay in the US's oppressive capitalist structure. There are socialist havens you can escape to that aren't far away and live out the remainder of your life in happiness. Why not go to one of those countries of milk and honey?
So your touchstone of success is catching up in 100 years to what the U.S. and its colonial antecedents developed over 500 years of war, slavery, genocide, colonialism, and debt slavery. Not improving over the capitalist average, which the socialist countries on the whole have done, or improving on their own situation prior to socialism, as every socialist country has done. I suppose your political models of yesteryear were there to argue against democracy because the U.S. at its foundation had such a lower standard of living than absolutist France.
 

Number_58

Mayor
So your touchstone of success is catching up in 100 years to what the U.S. and its colonial antecedents developed over 500 years of war, slavery, genocide, colonialism, and debt slavery. Not improving over the capitalist average, which the socialist countries on the whole have done, or improving on their own situation prior to socialism, as every socialist country has done. I suppose your political models of yesteryear were there to argue against democracy because the U.S. at its foundation had such a lower standard of living than absolutist France.
You forgot to include the shining example of a successful socialist or communist country where the population prospered as a whole...
 

EatTheRich

President
You forgot to include the shining example of a successful socialist or communist country where the population prospered as a whole...
Compared to what? Prospered by what metric? Cubans on average live longer than people from
the U.S. … indicating that they are relatively well-provisioned.
 

Number_58

Mayor
Compared to what? Prospered by what metric? Cubans on average live longer than people from
the U.S. … indicating that they are relatively well-provisioned.
It's not that far away. Move over there and keep us updated on how much your quality of life has improved. You've got nothing to lose...right?
 
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