Tell me again, why do the rich need more of my money

[OldGaffer]

Some of the actions of the corporations involved were illegal. Some were enabled by GLB. Letting brokerages and banks merge was a big part of the problem and that only happened as a result of repealing Glass/Steagal.

The Wingers are all into just blame the victims. It is part of their dog eat dog social darwinist mind set.

 

[Lukey]

No. Securitization in a totally deregulated market meant that there was no accountability. You could put a bunch of mortgages into a Mortgage Backed Security, pay Moody's to evaluate the bond and then sell it as an investment grade bond when it was actually crap. Lehman was even selling the MBS short (through a credit default swap) betting that the security would go bust...even while recommending it to investors.

Low interest rates alone would not have resulted in people unable to pay their mortgages. It was predatory low initial rates and baloon payments or adjustable rates that climbed into the teens and even doubled mortgage payments that pushed people over the edge. Speculation had a lot to do with it, people putting money into homes being built with the goal of sitting on the property until it increased in value and then selling it....like the Tulip crash in Holland.

And this "speculation" was not in any way a function of the artificially low interest rates over an extended period?

 

[Lukey]

How much was spent on actual healthcare, and how much went to execs?

Spoken like a true Marxist!

 

[OldGaffer]

Spoken like a true Marxist!

Spoken like a true Fascist!

Fun to play these bullshit semantics games, right? Where you get to make your own definitions and then use them like they are legitimate. Just admit you are a social darwinist and call it a day.

 

[OldGaffer]

Social Darwinism is a term commonly used for theories of society that emerged in England and the United States in the 1870s, seeking to apply the principles of Darwinian evolution to sociology and politics.[1] It especially refers to notions of struggle for existence being used to justify social policies which make no distinction between those able to support themselves and those unable to support themselves. The most prominent form of such views stressed competition between individuals in laissez-faire capitalism

If it walks like a duck...


The best-adapted and most successful social groups survive these conflicts, raising the evolutionary level of society generally (the 'survival of the fittest')."[5]

And talks like a duck....

 

[Lukey]

Social Darwinism is a term commonly used for theories of society that emerged in England and the United States in the 1870s, seeking to apply the principles of Darwinian evolution to sociology and politics.[1] It especially refers to notions of struggle for existence being used to justify social policies which make no distinction between those able to support themselves and those unable to support themselves. The most prominent form of such views stressed competition between individuals in laissez-faire capitalism

If it walks like a duck...


The best-adapted and most successful social groups survive these conflicts, raising the evolutionary level of society generally (the 'survival of the fittest')."[5]

And talks like a duck....

And what do we use to refer to the notion of "struggle for existence" that makes no distinction between those "unable to support themselves" and those "unwilling to support themselves?" Or, for that matter, the theory of society that is used to justify ever increasing levels of affluence included in the "those unable to support themselves" contingent?

 

[zzigzzag]

"Capitalist". OK. Then why are you apparently defending sending jobs to China? I'll stick with "money worshiper".

I think the definition gets muddled when someone employs slave labor in a communist country that's eating our lunch to attain their capitalistic goals.

 

[zzigzzag]

"This is the part where he either runs away or changes the subject."

Naaahhh....this is the part where I sit back and watch MV eviscerate y'all with facts and figures.

I always admit when something is over my head. It's the closest I come to "charming".

What enables me is the one thing I know for sure. Y'all make shit up on the rare occasion that someone isn't doing it for you.

 

[zzigzzag]

All of your posts on this thread can be answered with a simple, "So what?"

 

[OldGaffer]

"Capitalist". OK. Then why are you apparently defending sending jobs to China? I'll stick with "money worshiper".

I think the definition gets muddled when someone employs slave labor in a communist country that's eating our lunch to attain their capitalistic goals.

Bingo, Lukey always ignores that one salient fact.

 

[zzigzzag]

"Or, for that matter, the theory of society that is used to justify ever increasing levels of affluence included in the "those unable to support themselves" contingent?"

"Affluence". Good one. You worried about the influence of the "Big Poverty" lobbyists?