Thanks Fareed Zakaria

[middleview]

Are tomahawks the only missiles capable of delivering nuclear payloads? Nah, so you set up a straw man and kick his ass (again) while avoiding the truth. Pointing out that the MK 41 is a "ballistic system" is a pedantic non sequitur. Are they or aren't they capable of delivering nuclear payloads? Are they or aren't they deployed on Russia's "doorstep?"

You keep saying the invasion was "unprovoked" but clearly Putin laid out his concerns related to these "defensive" missiles:

FACTBOX-Russia's unveils security proposals to U.S. and NATO (devdiscourse.com)

Did anyone offer to sit down and discuss these (legitimate) concerns? Nah, we just kept preparing to push NATO closer to Moscow. Would the US allow Russia to put Iskanders in Montreal?

Really? Montreal?

Do you have specs on the MK41? Can it carry a nuke? Can the HIMARS?

Russia has missile subs 50 miles off our coast. Are we going to war over it?

Now Putin wants to keep Donbas and Crimea. Will that keep NATO from putting those missiles in western Ukraine?

 

[middleview]

Are tomahawks the only missiles capable of delivering nuclear payloads? Nah, so you set up a straw man and kick his ass (again) while avoiding the truth. Pointing out that the MK 41 is a "ballistic system" is a pedantic non sequitur. Are they or aren't they capable of delivering nuclear payloads? Are they or aren't they deployed on Russia's "doorstep?"

You keep saying the invasion was "unprovoked" but clearly Putin laid out his concerns related to these "defensive" missiles:

FACTBOX-Russia's unveils security proposals to U.S. and NATO (devdiscourse.com)

Did anyone offer to sit down and discuss these (legitimate) concerns? Nah, we just kept preparing to push NATO closer to Moscow. Would the US allow Russia to put Iskanders in Montreal?

Patriot missiles have been deployed to Poland. They are not nuclear and are clearly defensive.

These are the missile defense systems the US sent to Poland | CNN Politics

Today, U.S. tactical nuclear weapons remain at six bases in five NATO member countries, Belgium, Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, and Turkey. The UK and France have their own nuclear forces and no longer host U.S. weapons.

Nuclear Weapons in Europe: Mapping U.S. and Russian Deployments | Council on Foreign Relations (cfr.org)

 

[middleview]

Are tomahawks the only missiles capable of delivering nuclear payloads? Nah, so you set up a straw man and kick his ass (again) while avoiding the truth. Pointing out that the MK 41 is a "ballistic system" is a pedantic non sequitur. Are they or aren't they capable of delivering nuclear payloads? Are they or aren't they deployed on Russia's "doorstep?"

You keep saying the invasion was "unprovoked" but clearly Putin laid out his concerns related to these "defensive" missiles:

FACTBOX-Russia's unveils security proposals to U.S. and NATO (devdiscourse.com)

Did anyone offer to sit down and discuss these (legitimate) concerns? Nah, we just kept preparing to push NATO closer to Moscow. Would the US allow Russia to put Iskanders in Montreal?

By the way...read the proposal from the Kremlin. They are dramatically in violation of much of it. Were Russian troops in Belarus in December 2021, how about Moldova?
Did Russia have missiles deployed that could hit anywhere in Europe?

Russia demanded nuclear weapons be withdrawn to the countries that owned them...clearly that would only be the US tactical nukes in Germany, Belgium, Italy and Turkey. These are battlefield nukes and not a threat to Russia unless Russian tanks roll into NATO countries.

They also demand that the US Navy restrict ships to US territorial waters....hilarious. So we'd have all 300 or so of our ships to within 50 miles of the US? Of course they'd like that, since their navy is barely able to keep itself afloat.

Do you suppose Russia would agree to withdrawing all troops from Georgia, Chechnya, Belarus, Ukraine, Venezuela? Would China agree to keeping their navy to within 50 miles of their coast?

 

[middleview]

Where is your evidence that "Russians" created that zip file? You, of course, have none. This was almost certainly an inside job. There is no evidence the zip file was "exfiltrated" because it wasn't, at least not from the primary server. The most likely way the file was "exfiltrated" was from a back up server, which was almost certainly not connected to the internet. One the "Russians" didn't have access to.

There are absolutely collecting all of the backbone traffic, and most of the downstream as well.

NSA surveillance covers 75 percent of U.S. Internet traffic: WSJ

The National Security Agency's surveillance network has the capacity to reach around 75 percent of all U.S. Internet communications in the hunt for foreign intelligence, the Wall Street Journal reported on Tuesday.

www.reuters.com

You have tried this gaslighting before and I keep correcting you but you persist. The only reason one can determine as to why, is that you are a hack (and therefor not interested in the truth).

Did you read the article?

 

[Raoul_Luke]

By the way...read the proposal from the Kremlin. They are dramatically in violation of much of it. Were Russian troops in Belarus in December 2021, how about Moldova?
Did Russia have missiles deployed that could hit anywhere in Europe?

Russia demanded nuclear weapons be withdrawn to the countries that owned them...clearly that would only be the US tactical nukes in Germany, Belgium, Italy and Turkey. These are battlefield nukes and not a threat to Russia unless Russian tanks roll into NATO countries.

They also demand that the US Navy restrict ships to US territorial waters....hilarious. So we'd have all 300 or so of our ships to within 50 miles of the US? Of course they'd like that, since their navy is barely able to keep itself afloat.

Do you suppose Russia would agree to withdrawing all troops from Georgia, Chechnya, Belarus, Ukraine, Venezuela? Would China agree to keeping their navy to within 50 miles of their coast?

First off, it was a proposal, not a binding agreement, so how could they be "in violation" of it? Apparently you have never done any negotiating, because it is standard procedure to list what you are willing to do (or stop doing) in return for what you want from the counter party. You also ask for way more than what you expect to get. So none of this is surprising (or unreasonable). Nor is their demand to be free from the threat of NATO missiles that can be configured into attack mode with relative ease.

 

[middleview]

First off, it was a proposal, not a binding agreement, so how could they be "in violation" of it? Apparently you have never done any negotiating, because it is standard procedure to list what you are willing to do (or stop doing) in return for what you want from the counter party. You also ask for way more than what you expect to get. So none of this is surprising (or unreasonable). Nor is their demand to be free from the threat of NATO missiles that can be configured into attack mode with relative ease.

Meanwhile...are any European nations threatened by Russian missiles? Are they nuclear missiles?

So the nations with nukes are Britain and France...and Russia.

 

[Raoul_Luke]

Did you read the article?

Do you think that article reveals the entire extent of what the NSA is doing?

 

[Raoul_Luke]

Meanwhile...are any European nations threatened by Russian missiles? Are they nuclear missiles?

So the nations with nukes are Britain and France...and Russia.

And again, would we be okay with Russia putting "defensive" missiles with offensive capabilities in Montreal?

 

[middleview]

Do you think that article reveals the entire extent of what the NSA is doing?

So you cannot answer the question, eh? So based on your post and link...could the Russians have hacked a system at the DNC....then the Email server...extract email and compress it to a .ZIP file, copy the .ZIP file from the Email server to the office system and from there to a system out of the DNC complex, but not in another country?

Domestic internet traffic was excluded from capture. So now that the data is on their own system at the Russian embassy or their safe house, move it to a thumb drive and fly it to Britain for a meeting with Wiki.

It was probably the Russians.
Donald Trump when asked about the DNC system hack.

Has it occurred to you that if the NSA were actually capturing all internet traffic it would be impossible for hackers to attack systems and hold them hostage for bitcoin ransom?

 

[middleview]

And again, would we be okay with Russia putting "defensive" missiles with offensive capabilities in Montreal?

Again....are any European nations threatened by Russian missiles? Are they nuclear missiles?

 

[Raoul_Luke]

Again....are any European nations threatened by Russian missiles? Are they nuclear missiles?

Again...what does that have to do with us?

 

[middleview]

Let's start with the murders since 9/11:

https://geopoliticaleconomy.com/2023/05/18/us-911-wars-million-deaths-displace/

"Wars the US waged in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Yemen, and Pakistan following September 11, 2001 caused at least 4.5 million deaths and displaced 38 to 60 million people, with 7.6 million children starving today, according to studies by Brown University."

Why should anyone profit from the misery the US has inflicted on the above states?

1. The Syrian civil war was waged between Syrian military and security forces and various rebel groups. The US only became involved when ISIS fighters invaded Iraq from Syria in 2014. Blaming the US for the casualties caused by Syrian and Russian air strikes on rebel held cities is disingenious at best.
2. The US isn't waging war in Yemen or Pakistan.
3. The US was attacked by forces that trained in Afghanistan.
4. We should not have invaded Iraq....how many of the casualties were caused by AQI or ISIS?

 

[middleview]

Again...what does that have to do with us?

It demolishes your attempt to blame Nato for Putin's invasion.

 

[Raoul_Luke]

So you cannot answer the question, eh? So based on your post and link...could the Russians have hacked a system at the DNC....then the Email server...extract email and compress it to a .ZIP file, copy the .ZIP file from the Email server to the office system and from there to a system out of the DNC complex, but not in another country?

Domestic internet traffic was excluded from capture. So now that the data is on their own system at the Russian embassy or their safe house, move it to a thumb drive and fly it to Britain for a meeting with Wiki.

It was probably the Russians.
Donald Trump when asked about the DNC system hack.

Has it occurred to you that if the NSA were actually capturing all internet traffic it would be impossible for hackers to attack systems and hold them hostage for bitcoin ransom?

Did they? Crowdstrike, if you recall, the only entity the DNC allowed access to the server(s), could find no evidence of it.

It was supposed to be, but wasn't.

Yes, the Russians did hack the DNC - but did they "exfiltrate" the emails? The only investigator (again) has no idea.

So there is no such thing as public wifi? TOR? They can only track the traffic leaving a US network and follow it until they hit a dead end. We've been over this a hundred times. I told you about me neighbor who was subjected to an FBI raid looking for child porn on his computers after his wife's laptop was stolen. The perps were sitting at the end of our street accessing his wifi. I thought you worked in IT...

 

[middleview]

Did they? Crowdstrike, if you recall, the only entity the DNC allowed access to the server(s), could find no evidence of it.

It was supposed to be, but wasn't.

Yes, the Russians did hack the DNC - but did they "exfiltrate" the emails? The only investigator (again) has no idea.

So there is no such thing as public wifi? TOR? They can only track the traffic leaving a US network and follow it until they hit a dead end. We've been over this a hundred times. I told you about me neighbor who was subjected to an FBI raid looking for child porn on his computers after his wife's laptop was stolen. The perps were sitting at the end of our street accessing his wifi. I thought you worked in IT...

Holy shit....you think the NSA was involved in the raid on your neighbors? Even if the NSA picked up access between a computer in the US and a porn site in Europe I'd bet they would not share that with the FBI.

Just for the sake of debate....how about if the guy sharing kiddie porn got caught...the FBI then used his computer to track those accessing and sharing porn with him?

WTF does public WIFI have to do with anything?

Again...if the NSA captured everything how would ransomware be possible?

 

[georgephillip]

1. The Syrian civil war was waged between Syrian military and security forces and various rebel groups. The US only became involved when ISIS fighters invaded Iraq from Syria in 2014. Blaming the US for the casualties caused by Syrian and Russian air strikes on rebel held cities is disingenious at best.

Where did those ISIS fighters get their weapons?
The same place Afghanistan's mujahideen did during an earlier epoch of US imperialism?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timber_Sycamore

"One consequence of the (Timber Sycamore) program has been a flood of US weapons including assault rifles, mortars and rocket-propelled grenades into the Middle East's black market.

"Critics saw it as ineffective and expensive, and raised concerns about diversion of weapons to jihadist groups and about Timber Sycamore-backed rebels fighting alongside the al-Nusra Front.[9]

"In July 2017, US officials stated that Timber Sycamore would be phased out, with funds possibly redirected to fighting the Islamic State (IS), or to offering rebel forces defensive capabilities."

 

[Raoul_Luke]

It demolishes your attempt to blame Nato for Putin's invasion.

So you are saying we would be okay with Putin putting missiles in Montreal?

 

[middleview]

Can the same be said of MK 41s? Of course not. Those are located in Poland and Romania...as close as 800 miles from Moscow. Putin can't attack them, as they are NATO members, so he attacked Ukraine, in order to prevent them from becoming one and possibly hosting MK 41s even closer to Moscow.

“Are we deploying missiles near the U.S. border? No, we are not. It is the United States that has come to our home with its missiles and is already standing at our doorstep,” Mr. Putin said in December at his annual news conference.

On the Edge of a Polish Forest, Where Some of Putin’s Darkest Fears Lurk - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

Nothing to see here, move along...

USAAMDSRO is under the operational control of the U.S. Navy’s Sixth Fleet based in Naples, Italy, and is part of the European Phased Adapted Approach (EPAA), which protects European NATO allies and U.S. deployed forces in the region. This land-based missile defense facility is designed to detect, track, engage, and destroy ballistic missiles in flight outside the atmosphere. Its technology is nearly identical to and works in coordination with the systems used on the four forward-deployed naval forces Europe Aegis destroyers.

U.S. AEGIS Ashore Missile Defense System Romania Changes Command > United States Navy > News Stories

 

[middleview]

Where did those ISIS fighters get their weapons?
The same place Afghanistan's mujahideen did during an earlier epoch of US imperialism?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timber_Sycamore

"One consequence of the (Timber Sycamore) program has been a flood of US weapons including assault rifles, mortars and rocket-propelled grenades into the Middle East's black market.

"Critics saw it as ineffective and expensive, and raised concerns about diversion of weapons to jihadist groups and about Timber Sycamore-backed rebels fighting alongside the al-Nusra Front.[9]

"In July 2017, US officials stated that Timber Sycamore would be phased out, with funds possibly redirected to fighting the Islamic State (IS), or to offering rebel forces defensive capabilities."

When the US disbanded the Iraqi army they did not disarm those soldiers. When ISIS invaded Iraq from Syria the Iraqi army ran away...leaving a lot of weapons behind to be captured by ISIS.

Did the US arm ISIS? Only by arming our allies who then surrendered weapons to ISIS.

 

[middleview]

So you are saying we would be okay with Putin putting missiles in Montreal?

Offensive missiles aimed at the US? Let me know when that happens. Your bullshit hypothetical misses the context of why nations have joined NATO. Has the US occupied Canadian territory? Nope. Has the US attempted to dictate to Canada what other nations they can sign agreements with? Nope.

If the US and Canada were adversaries it would be a completely different set of circumstances.

As it is, the anti-missile systems installed in Romania and Poland are not offensive missiles and the US has discontinued production of Tomahawks capable of carrying nuclear weapons as part of the INF treaty.