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Why must we become either a theoacary or commie hellhole????

If I listened to every wailing libertarian and conservative these days I would either become a drunk or suicidal. Cheer up. You folks will have at least four more years to grind your teeth in rage at yet another Clinton running the nation. Why, it might even get Rushbo his sponsors back. Look at the bright side.
 

TheResister

Council Member
Sheep Goosestepping Behind Chickenhawks

Through a republic, the powerful are enabled to deprive the majority of its own individual rights. And the gutless, selfish, spoiled sons of those empowered by the oligarchy's Constitution never have to fight, bleed, or die, so don't go all patriotic on me to cover up that treason.

That may change soon. The enemies of democracy will get complacent, too lazy to make the effort to continue their cradle-to-grave brainwashing glorifying their class-biased political, economic, and educational institutions.
The Democrats are the epitome of power gone wrong. The masses have no advantage over the rest of America.

Modern day Establishment Republicans are socialist lite as they bow down to the POLICE STATE activists within their own ranks. While neither side impresses me, the founding fathers of this country did set the example of what it takes to build a country predicated upon Liberty. Democracy is the antithesis of Liberty.
 
The Democrats are the epitome of power gone wrong. The masses have no advantage over the rest of America.

Modern day Establishment Republicans are socialist lite as they bow down to the POLICE STATE activists within their own ranks. While neither side impresses me, the founding fathers of this country did set the example of what it takes to build a country predicated upon Liberty. Democracy is the antithesis of Liberty.
Their Elitist Anti-Democratic Constitution Is What Put the Crack in the Liberty Bell

The real founding fathers were the pioneers out on the frontier, not wags wearing wigs scheming behind closed doors in Philadelphia. Just like the Bolsheviks imitated the Czars, our revolutionary leaders imitated the British House of Lords.
 

Emily

NSDAP Kanzler
The real founding fathers were the pioneers out on the frontier, not wags wearing wigs scheming behind closed doors in Philadelphia. Just like the Bolsheviks imitated the Czars, our revolutionary leaders imitated the British House of Lords.
Okay, let's take that as a given right now. Didn't the system that the wags in wigs (I love your way with words!) established allow for an unprecedented level of freedom, opportunity, and prosperity? Not only for the elites -- it certainly did that -- but for everyone (excluding slaves)? Yes, the system has gone awry; you & I agree on that, if not on the underlying cause of it. Though isn't part of that going awry caused or exemplified by the nation's departing from the original vision and the constitution that was meant to guard it?
 

TheResister

Council Member
Their Elitist Anti-Democratic Constitution Is What Put the Crack in the Liberty Bell

The real founding fathers were the pioneers out on the frontier, not wags wearing wigs scheming behind closed doors in Philadelphia. Just like the Bolsheviks imitated the Czars, our revolutionary leaders imitated the British House of Lords.

It was through those "wags wearing wigs" that the principles of government were created that helped the working class work in an atmosphere of Liberty.
 
Okay, let's take that as a given right now. Didn't the system that the wags in wigs (I love your way with words!) established allow for an unprecedented level of freedom, opportunity, and prosperity? Not only for the elites -- it certainly did that -- but for everyone (excluding slaves)? Yes, the system has gone awry; you & I agree on that, if not on the underlying cause of it. Though isn't part of that going awry caused or exemplified by the nation's departing from the original vision and the constitution that was meant to guard it?
A Republic Is an Exclusivist Elitist Oligarchy

Unprecedented for the 18th Century. But it never deserved to become supreme law, which is a fascist concept. For our freedom to grow with the times, it should have been only a temporary start-up document. All its commandments should have been subject to repeal by a simple majority, just like all our other laws. There was no divinely enlightening Second Coming in the 18th Century that should make us nostalgic for that as a Golden Age.
 
It was through those "wags wearing wigs" that the principles of government were created that helped the working class work in an atmosphere of Liberty.
A Crippling Overlord on Self-Determination

They rose to the middle class through violent and bankrupting unionizing, not through your imaginary Constitutional rights. In fact, once they got suckered into that political chain gang authorized by your Sacred Cow, their power started to dwindle.
 

TheResister

Council Member
A Crippling Overlord on Self-Determination

They rose to the middle class through violent and bankrupting unionizing, not through your imaginary Constitutional rights. In fact, once they got suckered into that political chain gang authorized by your Sacred Cow, their power started to dwindle.
Unions did not start organizing until the 1880s. Thomas Jefferson died in 1826; James Madison died in 1836; George Washington died in 1799.

I don't view the founding fathers as demigods or anything like that at all. I have major disagreements with a lot of what they did. George Washington and Benjamin Franklin were Masons - regardless of whether the conspiracy was known or not to them at that time.

Still, all in all, the founding fathers created the greatest nation in the annals of history.
 
Unions did not start organizing until the 1880s. Thomas Jefferson died in 1826; James Madison died in 1836; George Washington died in 1799.

I don't view the founding fathers as demigods or anything like that at all. I have major disagreements with a lot of what they did. George Washington and Benjamin Franklin were Masons - regardless of whether the conspiracy was known or not to them at that time.

Still, all in all, the founding fathers created the greatest nation in the annals of history.
What inadequacy makes you desperately search for father figures?
 

TheResister

Council Member
What inadequacy makes you desperately search for father figures?
Founding fathers refers to the position of our American predecessors.

OTOH, the failures of people within my generation and the one that preceded mine - not to mention the current crop about to assume power means that we should seek out sound counsel and successful / proven leadership strategies.

We aren't getting that from the Ds, the Rs, conservatives, liberals, left or right. What we've gotten for the past few generations is a bastardized form of government that is dangerous to the preservation and advancement of the cause of Liberty.
 
Founding fathers refers to the position of our American predecessors.

OTOH, the failures of people within my generation and the one that preceded mine - not to mention the current crop about to assume power means that we should seek out sound counsel and successful / proven leadership strategies.

We aren't getting that from the Ds, the Rs, conservatives, liberals, left or right. What we've gotten for the past few generations is a bastardized form of government that is dangerous to the preservation and advancement of the cause of Liberty.
Topple the Top. Revolution Energizes.

The Constitution is an anti-democratic manifesto that demoralizes the majority. It and the parasitic snake class it empowers are what has led to American decline. Real men don't let some clique boss us around and tell us what is wrong with us.
 

TheResister

Council Member
Topple the Top. Revolution Energizes.

The Constitution is an anti-democratic manifesto that demoralizes the majority. It and the parasitic snake class it empowers are what has led to American decline. Real men don't let some clique boss us around and tell us what is wrong with us.
And in a democracy, we allow a majority to make our decisions.

So, on one hand you have a government that is a Republic. “The purpose of government,” said Thomas Jefferson, “is to allow for the preservation of life and liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” Any other function assumed by government is usurpation and oppression.

"It is of great importance in a republic not only to guard the society against the oppression of its rulers, but to guard one part of the society against the injustice of the other part. Different interests necessarily exist in different classes of citizens. If a majority be united by a common interest, the rights of the minority will be insecure." James Madison, Federalist Paper # 51


Alexander Hamilton asserted that "We are now forming a Republican form of government. Real liberty is not found in the extremes of democracy, but in moderate governments. If we incline too much to democracy we shall soon shoot into a monarchy, or some other form of a dictatorship." Hamilton, in the last letter he ever wrote, warned that "our real disease is DEMOCRACY."


Thomas Jefferson declared: "A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine."


Benjamin Franklin had similar concerns of a democracy when he warned that “Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!” After the Constitutional Convention was concluded, in 1787, a bystander inquired of Franklin: "Well, Doctor, what have we gota Republic or a Monarchy?" Franklin replied, "A Republic, if you can keep it."


John Adams, our second president, wrote: “Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself.”


James Madison, the father of the Constitution wrote in Federalist Paper No. 10 that pure democracies “have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths.”


The Constitution itself, in Article IV, Section 4, declares: "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government.” Obviously the Framers were not speaking of a political party, as no political parties existed at that time. The Pledge of Allegiance, although not a founding document, does strike the right chord when it asks Americans to "pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands."

Maybe you're right. America was founded as an anti-democratic country. Then again, maybe there is a reason. A democracy, on the other hand, is a dangerous form of government.
 
And in a democracy, we allow a majority to make our decisions.

So, on one hand you have a government that is a Republic. “The purpose of government,” said Thomas Jefferson, “is to allow for the preservation of life and liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” Any other function assumed by government is usurpation and oppression.

"It is of great importance in a republic not only to guard the society against the oppression of its rulers, but to guard one part of the society against the injustice of the other part. Different interests necessarily exist in different classes of citizens. If a majority be united by a common interest, the rights of the minority will be insecure." James Madison, Federalist Paper # 51


Alexander Hamilton asserted that "We are now forming a Republican form of government. Real liberty is not found in the extremes of democracy, but in moderate governments. If we incline too much to democracy we shall soon shoot into a monarchy, or some other form of a dictatorship." Hamilton, in the last letter he ever wrote, warned that "our real disease is DEMOCRACY."


Thomas Jefferson declared: "A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine."


Benjamin Franklin had similar concerns of a democracy when he warned that “Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!” After the Constitutional Convention was concluded, in 1787, a bystander inquired of Franklin: "Well, Doctor, what have we gota Republic or a Monarchy?" Franklin replied, "A Republic, if you can keep it."


John Adams, our second president, wrote: “Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself.”


James Madison, the father of the Constitution wrote in Federalist Paper No. 10 that pure democracies “have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths.”


The Constitution itself, in Article IV, Section 4, declares: "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government.” Obviously the Framers were not speaking of a political party, as no political parties existed at that time. The Pledge of Allegiance, although not a founding document, does strike the right chord when it asks Americans to "pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands."

Maybe you're right. America was founded as an anti-democratic country. Then again, maybe there is a reason. A democracy, on the other hand, is a dangerous form of government.
A Republic Is a Corrupt and Incompetent Hereditary Oligarchy

You quote all those primitive 18th Century thinkers as if they spoke undeniable truths from some typically mythical Golden Age. Today's enemies of democracy should be forced to quit their bullying preaching and start whining in surrender. You know perfectly well that if your Masters let up on their loud and incessant brainwashing, the disempowered American people will quickly realize that we are being ruled by a Paper Tiger.
 

TheResister

Council Member
A Republic Is a Corrupt and Incompetent Hereditary Oligarchy

You quote all those primitive 18th Century thinkers as if they spoke undeniable truths from some typically mythical Golden Age. Today's enemies of democracy should be forced to quit their bullying preaching and start whining in surrender. You know perfectly well that if your Masters let up on their loud and incessant brainwashing, the disempowered American people will quickly realize that we are being ruled by a Paper Tiger.

The Paper Tiger to which you allude is the phony fight between conservatives and liberals; left and right; Democrat and Republican. The de jure / lawful government in the United States is a constitutional Republic. Instead we're being ruled by an illegal / de facto government. The de facto government is a federal / legislative Democracy owned and controlled by an elite number of corporations.

Sure, the Liberties that we should have exist only on paper and there aren't any real leaders out there willing to stand up and get to people motivated to reclaim their God given Rights.
 
The Paper Tiger to which you allude is the phony fight between conservatives and liberals; left and right; Democrat and Republican. The government in the United States is a constitutional Republic. Instead we're being ruled by an illegal / de facto government. The de facto government is owned and controlled by an elite number of corporations.

Sure, the Liberties that we should have exist only on paper and there aren't any real leaders out there willing to stand up and get to people motivated to reclaim their God given Rights.
Desperately Seeking Father Figures

Your magical Constitution was supposed to prevent the situation you describe. So even by your own ideology, the Constitution was a weak failure and should have been drawn up by wiser and more strong-minded people than your magical founding fathers.
 

TheResister

Council Member
Desperately Seeking Father Figures

Your magical Constitution was supposed to prevent the situation you describe. So even by your own ideology, the Constitution was a weak failure and should have been drawn up by wiser and more strong-minded people than your magical founding fathers.
Nothing magically happens.

America is at a critical stage where somebody has to step forward and say enough is enough. Once you're exhausted your nonviolent legal and political avenues of redress, it's time to do the extraordinary.

We are rapidly approaching that time. In a Democracy, the only rule is mob rule. In a Republic, the tyrants will pretend to have acted in accordance with the law - and back it up with mob rule. But, those who long for Liberty will tire of the status quo at some point and then they will do what is just and expected.
 
Nothing magically happens.

America is at a critical stage where somebody has to step forward and say enough is enough. Once you're exhausted your nonviolent legal and political avenues of redress, it's time to do the extraordinary.

We are rapidly approaching that time. In a Democracy, the only rule is mob rule. In a Republic, the tyrants will pretend to have acted in accordance with the law - and back it up with mob rule. But, those who long for Liberty will tire of the status quo at some point and then they will do what is just and expected.
Those Who Feel Superior to the Majority Will Betray the American People

Constitutionalists are the kind of intellectual bullies that are the real problem in all sectors. Real men don't let servants of the ruling class tell us what rule we have to live under. That anti-democratic manifesto is totally superfluous; the body of laws our elected representatives vote for makes it so. Instead of going backward by keeping that 18th Century overlord on the people's free will, we should have more laws made by national referendums

"Mob rule"? Blah, blah, blah. You're just parroting what your idolized Masters tell you to squeak. They want Snob Rule and must be brought to their knees, not knelt in front of, like their bootlickers do. How dare that High-and-mighty lowlife insult the American people?

Despite their tough mouths, bossy blowhards will run like the sissies they are once they are stood up to. We don't play fair with such enemies; we gang up on them and crush them like grapes. Time for majoritarians to quit whining and start making wine.
 

TheResister

Council Member
Those Who Feel Superior to the Majority Will Betray the American People

Constitutionalists are the kind of intellectual bullies that are the real problem in all sectors. Real men don't let servants of the ruling class tell us what rule we have to live under. That anti-democratic manifesto is totally superfluous; the body of laws our elected representatives vote for makes it so. Instead of going backward by keeping that 18th Century overlord on the people's free will, we should have more laws made by national referendums

"Mob rule"? Blah, blah, blah. You're just parroting what your idolized Masters tell you to squeak. They want Snob Rule and must be brought to their knees, not knelt in front of, like their bootlickers do. How dare that High-and-mighty lowlife insult the American people?

Despite their tough mouths, bossy blowhards will run like the sissies they are once they are stood up to. We don't play fair with such enemies; we gang up on them and crush them like grapes. Time for majoritarians to quit whining and start making wine.
In debating all of this with you, it's obvious that one side or the other will some day prevail.

I see bullies as the ones who think a majority gives them the right to infringe upon me. If Hitlery Clinton don't want to have a gun and her supporters agree, why force me to join in that kind of destruction?

If the liberals and Democrats want to have socialized health care and I don't want to be a socialist, what rights do I have save of those the majority is willing to grant me?

Oh yeah, constitutionalists are real bullies... NOT. They want you to have Rights; to have options; to be able to elect NOT to participate in things you find morally reprehensible or objectionable.
 
In debating all of this with you, it's obvious that one side or the other will some day prevail.

I see bullies as the ones who think a majority gives them the right to infringe upon me. If Hitlery Clinton doesn't want to have a gun and her supporters agree, why force me to join in that kind of destruction?

If the liberals and Democrats want to have socialized health care and I don't want to be a socialist, what rights do I have save of those the majority is willing to grant me?

Oh yeah, constitutionalists are real bullies... NOT. They want you to have Rights; to have options; to be able to elect NOT to participate in things you find morally reprehensible or objectionable.
Save the Strawmen. You'll Need the Straws to Drink Your Kool-Aid.

You make up scare-story scenarios to justify your support of the 1%, the minority that controls all other minorities. Their sons and daughters took over the Democratic Party and redefined what democracy is supposed to mean. It is revealing that a Right Winger like Cal Thomas preached that the new Filipino President's idea of mass killing of criminals was "undemocratic." That is exactly what the majority wants in any country, so upper-class guillotine fodder always call democracy just the opposite of what it really means.
 

TheResister

Council Member
Save the Strawmen. You'll Need the Straws to Drink Your Kool-Aid.

You make up scare-story scenarios to justify your support of the 1%, the minority that controls all other minorities. Their sons and daughters took over the Democratic Party and redefined what democracy is supposed to mean. It is revealing that a Right Winger like Cal Thomas preached that the new Filipino President's idea of mass killing of criminals was "undemocratic." That is exactly what the majority wants in any country, so upper-class guillotine fodder always call democracy just the opposite of what it really means.
Now you're literally grasping at straws (forgive the pun.) There are no strawmen in what I've said.

The Democrats have an agenda. Maybe you'd better start with learning exactly what it is Dems believe in:

https://demconvention.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/2016-DEMOCRATIC-PARTY-PLATFORM-DRAFT-7.1.16.pdf

Democracy - "government by the people; especially : rule of the majority"

The U.S. Army printed a manual in 1928. It is TM 2000-25. Allow me to present a few paragraphs:

" Democracy - A government of the masses. Authority derived through mass meeting or any other form of direct expression. Results in mobocracy. Attitude towards property is communistic***negating property rights. Attitude towards law is that the will of the majority shall regulate, whether it is based upon deliberation or governed by passion, prejudice, and impulse, without restraint or regard to consequences. Result is demagogism, licence, agitation, discontent, anarchy."

...



"CITIZENSHIP Republic:

"Authority is derived through the election by the people of public officials best fitted to represent them. Attitude toward law is the administration of justice in accord with fixed principles and established evidence, with a strict regard to consequences. A greater number of citizens and extent of territory may be brought within its compass. Avoids the dangerous extreme of either tyranny or mobocracy. Results in statesmanship, liberty, reason, justice, contentment, and progress. Is the "standard form" of government throughout the world. A republic is a form of government under a constitution which provides for the election of

"(1) an executive and (2) a legislative body, who working together in a representative capacity, have all the power of appointment, all power of legislation, all power to raise revenue and appropriate expenditures, and are required to create (3) a judiciary to pass upon the justice and legality of their government acts and to recognize (4) certain inherent individual rights.

"Take away any one or more of those four elements and you are drifting into autocracy. Add one or more to those four elements and you are drifting into democracy.

https://www.1215.org/lawnotes/lawnotes/repvdem.htm

Now, let's forget the Kool Aid talk and get down to the meat and potatoes. The definitions are accurate and are impartial as to political issues. Soooo...

Let me tell you where I disagree with Democrats on some issues. They think they can tax the rich and play Robin Hood. I'll use an analogy because every businessman can relate to this example since it happens every day of the year in America:

I went to work for a company and after a couple of years, increases in taxes forced them to figure out how to stay profitable and in business. So, they told the employees that, due to increased costs (i.e. taxes) they had to continue to give stockholders a profit and, as such, the employees would not get any raises or bonuses until further notice.

So, if the Democrats give you health care, a free college education, etc. know this: milking the rich will only cause the rich to get their money from the poor. Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders are oblivious to one harsh fact: NOTHING is for free. Government cannot give you anything without first taking it from a taxpayer. And once that taxpayer loses money, they raise the costs of their goods and services; they lay people off; they move their base of operations into countries where it is more conducive to business. But, they aren't going to jack up your wages and let you get more just because the have nots voted for a few freebies.

Now, if you're the "sage" you claim to be, you might try explaining to the people on this board how you ended up supporting a belief system that has failed throughout history. And I know what you're about to say, but don't go there.

The Republicans are stuck on stupid; have become socialist lite. You cannot defend the bass ackwardness of the Democrats by comparing yourself to an Establishment Republican.
 
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