YJ02
Council Member
Yes, today both Vindman's were fired from their jobs in the NSC. LTC Vindman was escorted by security off of WH grounds.
i dont start many threads-- this place has too many as it is!. Its long, but how can a discussion be had without the facts being presented?
As a army retiree, and a political independent person, I have mixed feelings over this whole Vindman thing-
-by going to testify, he disobeyed a valid (even more valid now that the President was not convicted) order
-but, by testifying he may have done the right thing as a citizen, although he did the incorrect thing for a soldier to do
A soldier, of any rank, cannot decide what orders to obey or not. The whole thing of "do not obey a illegal order" mainly pertains to matters where the illegality is obvious and exigent --like machine gunning unarmed civilians. His decision to take the Presidents order has illegal was poorly advised on him by his lawyer--he SHOULD have consulted a military lawyer, who are both trained in civil law and the Uniformed Code of Military Justice.
So he testified, ok, but I can guarantee you that if he remains in the Army- NO Colonel or General would want him under their command.
It would be very unlikely he be given the command of any unit. He will probably be 'riding a desk' the rest of his career.
the second part of this post
the reaction from places like CBS and CNN
the "He is a decorated war hero, the purple heart, the combat infantryman's badge... a proud immigrant.how can the President do this?"
Ok, first off, EVERY officer that has made it through ROTC or OCS or West Point is technically "decorated". One award or medal makes you so
His Purple Heart was not earned-as some CNN types would have you think- by leading troops in battle kicking down doors in Fallujah
nope, he got it when he was injured riding in a Humvee in Iraq. Yes, he was wounded, but in a passive action. his injuries were apparently not that severe as he was not medevac'd from Iraq and was back on duty a few days later
this is also how he apparently got the Combat Infantryman's Badge. Since 2001, the regs that govern how a Infantryman can be awarded a CIB have been changed. This change was pushed by officers who were not indirect combat units but in supporting Infantry Headquarters units, which rarely, if ever see direct action..so a infantryman may never fire a shot or even see an enemy and still be awarded the CIB for being in a unit that served in a combat zone
And, finally, the President can actually do this with cause or for no cause. A president is the Commander in Chief-too many people seem to forget what this implies. So yes, CNN, Vindman can be re-assigned to wherever the hell he army wants him to be-with or without the CinC's recommendations
But Vindman probably wont be going far. He has nearly 21 yrs of service, He only needs 20 to retire. My guess is he filed his retirement DA 4187 the day he testified
i dont start many threads-- this place has too many as it is!. Its long, but how can a discussion be had without the facts being presented?
As a army retiree, and a political independent person, I have mixed feelings over this whole Vindman thing-
-by going to testify, he disobeyed a valid (even more valid now that the President was not convicted) order
-but, by testifying he may have done the right thing as a citizen, although he did the incorrect thing for a soldier to do
A soldier, of any rank, cannot decide what orders to obey or not. The whole thing of "do not obey a illegal order" mainly pertains to matters where the illegality is obvious and exigent --like machine gunning unarmed civilians. His decision to take the Presidents order has illegal was poorly advised on him by his lawyer--he SHOULD have consulted a military lawyer, who are both trained in civil law and the Uniformed Code of Military Justice.
So he testified, ok, but I can guarantee you that if he remains in the Army- NO Colonel or General would want him under their command.
It would be very unlikely he be given the command of any unit. He will probably be 'riding a desk' the rest of his career.
the second part of this post
the reaction from places like CBS and CNN
the "He is a decorated war hero, the purple heart, the combat infantryman's badge... a proud immigrant.how can the President do this?"
Ok, first off, EVERY officer that has made it through ROTC or OCS or West Point is technically "decorated". One award or medal makes you so
His Purple Heart was not earned-as some CNN types would have you think- by leading troops in battle kicking down doors in Fallujah
nope, he got it when he was injured riding in a Humvee in Iraq. Yes, he was wounded, but in a passive action. his injuries were apparently not that severe as he was not medevac'd from Iraq and was back on duty a few days later
this is also how he apparently got the Combat Infantryman's Badge. Since 2001, the regs that govern how a Infantryman can be awarded a CIB have been changed. This change was pushed by officers who were not indirect combat units but in supporting Infantry Headquarters units, which rarely, if ever see direct action..so a infantryman may never fire a shot or even see an enemy and still be awarded the CIB for being in a unit that served in a combat zone
And, finally, the President can actually do this with cause or for no cause. A president is the Commander in Chief-too many people seem to forget what this implies. So yes, CNN, Vindman can be re-assigned to wherever the hell he army wants him to be-with or without the CinC's recommendations
But Vindman probably wont be going far. He has nearly 21 yrs of service, He only needs 20 to retire. My guess is he filed his retirement DA 4187 the day he testified
