For those that believe Rubio would have made a difference

[Union_Jack_1972]

Rubio would have not helped Romney. Anyone that believe Rubio would have helped Romney has no clue about how Hispanic\Latino communities work. Rubio would have carried the Cuban community but that is about it...

Nothin' would have gotten Romney elected, and that is a fact. Now with that said the GOP must embrace the Hispanic\Latino community. The GOP can not win anymore without this community. Them and the Asian community is the fastest growin' community in America. You have Texas for now but do not be foolish to think you will always have that state. Also do not believe you can only rely on the White vote.

Let be honest, and Admit the GOP must find it soul again. The GOP must do a Nixon with the Hispanic\Latino community just like Nixon did with the youth vote. To do so the GOP must toss that Anti-Immigration ideals,and come up with a real Immigration Reform Bill along with bringin' jobs not only to this one sector of America but we must open up better trade bills with Latin and South America. While doin' that we must also bring up those economies so those Illegals wantin' to come here will want to stay home and not endanger themselves and their family to come here.

So GOP the time has come to accept the wind of change or you will become the minority party that will be only for the White class if you do not embrace the change...

So change or stay a minority...

 

[bdtex]

Pres. Obama only needs 5-6 GOP Senators to get a DREAM Act and some form of immigration reform done and I can think of 6 off the top of my head who have a vested interest in getting it done...Heller,Flake,McCain,Cornyn,Cruz and Rubio. There are 2-3 others that I think might be partners in a bipartisan compromise.If House GOPs block it like they did in 2006,they'll get thumped in the 2014 midterm election just like they did in 2006.

 

[Union_Jack_1972]

Pres. Obama only needs 5-6 GOP Senators to get a DREAM Act and some form of immigration reform done and I can think of 6 off the top of my head who have a vested interest in getting it done...Heller,Flake,McCain,Cornyn,Cruz and Rubio. There are 2-3 others that I think might be partners in a bipartisan compromise.If House GOPs block it like they did in 2006,they'll get thumped in the 2014 midterm election just like they did in 2006.

Hosue GOP are going to be thumped in 2014 because of the Fiscal Cliff, and their unwillingness to work with Obama. If the Tea Party right were smart they would off JTPA's with the Tax incrase on those that make ten million or more a year. The JTPA's would be part of the Unemployment and Welfare package that would require all those gettin' Federal help must be enrolled in some form of JTPA. In two years our nation can turn out enough people for jobs in nursing, Physical Therapy, and much other needed areas. Then those that were on the government dime would be paying taxes back into the system.

Those millions of unemployed would be paying into the system, but alas the Tea Party right will not do this because it would fix so much, and damn it man they can't allow this to happen while Obama is President.

Also they can come up with a plan with the millions of illegal immigrants by issuing work visas to them but if they wanted to become residents or citizens they must return to their home country and apply there. With the work visa they will be legal to work, pay their fair share in taxes, but will not enjoy the fruits of the regular citizen.

Just a few things, but BD,you and I know they will never do this...

 

[NightSwimmer]

Even if the GOP were to abandon the xenophobic bloc of their base, they still wouldn't have a valid argument to lead. While the social wedge issues may be more morally revolting to ordinary Americans, the thoroughly discredited Voodoo economic policies espoused by the Republican Party are more dangerous to the nation's long-term viability.

I'm beginning to believe that it will be more likely for the Republican Party to simply fade into obscurity than to internally institute serious policy reform. That will open a space for a new political party to emerge and take the place of the GOP as the ideological alternative to the Democrats.

 

[lilly]

If Rubio ran for President and the GOP had a different mind set when it comes to Latinos they might have had a chance to win.

One said, 'It's pretty hard to warm up to them, when you know they hate you.

 

[Union_Jack_1972]

Even if the GOP were to abandon the xenophobic bloc of their base, they still wouldn't have a valid argument to lead. While the social wedge issues may be more morally revolting to ordinary Americans, the thoroughly discredited Voodoo economic policies espoused by the Republican Party are more dangerous to the nation's long-term viability.

I'm beginning to believe that it will be more likely for the Republican Party to simply fade into obscurity than to internally institute serious policy reform. That will open a space for a new political party to emerge and take the place of the GOP as the ideological alternative to the Democrats.

The Republican party came into power after they splitted from the Whig party and shed themselves of the Know Nothing crowd during the 1800's. It is said that they have allowed the racist element back into it fold, and turn the GOP into the 21st century versionof the Know Nothing.

As long as the GOP embraces the radical views of the Tea Party they will be forever a minority party. The Tea party just like the Know Nothing party base their policies on fear, hatred, and racism. They see someone like Obama a threat to the great white society while fearin' the growing number of Hispanic voters that one day will dictate the future elections even more than they do now.

GOP must shed the radical element, move right of center once again, and discover that to win they must embrace new ideals like their dear leaders Lincoln, Roosevelt, and Nixon did. They must understand the day of the majority white is dyin' out in this great nation of our, and if they do not adapt they will fall to the pages of history just like the Know Nothing and Reform Party....

 

[Union_Jack_1972]

If Rubio ran for President and the GOP had a different mind set when it comes to Latinos they might have had a chance to win.

One said, 'It's pretty hard to warm up to them, when you know they hate you.

Reagan, Bush jr., and those like McCain understood the importance of working with a minority group like the Hispanic voting block. The sad part is the Tea Party has no clue how important it is, and will be the death of the GOP because of their fear, hatred, and racist views to those that are not part of their great white society!!!

 

[Dino]

Big difference. Rubio would certainly have delivered Romney the state of Florida, and likely a good percentage more of northern Virginians. Romney wins those two states this election is about as close as Bush's win over Kerry. (I mean, if he won that one at all)

 

[degsme]

Big difference. Rubio would certainly have delivered Romney the state of Florida, and likely a good percentage more of northern Virginians. Romney wins those two states this election is about as close as Bush's win over Kerry. (I mean, if he won that one at all)

Perhaps... Perhaps not. Rubio is not a problem free character. Remember that his brother is a convicted drug felon who is closely related to Rubio's businesses and campaigns.

Also Rubio's story on how his parents emigrated has had more revisions than Romney's position on abortion. That sort of "flip flop" "Makes it up as he goes" resonance would have been bad for the Romney campaign and net net it would have probably been a LOSER in VA. And it might even have been a loser in NC.

Would it have won FL? Possibly, but you are ignoring that the "flip/flop" message would have alienated voters in FL as well. So that would have left it at a 303 EC vote win, and probabaly a STRONGER general election win (some of the anti-obama racism would have been ameiliorated by anti-rubio racism)

 

[Jen]

I agree that the GOP must find its soul again. True conservatism embraces everyone. There is nothing wrong with true conservatism - a belief that we are all in charge of our own destiny and that our own hard work should propel us into success and that the government is not needed to send us money or control our daily lives (what we eat, what we drive, how warm or cool we keep our homes, what we think). Self-reliance is the cornerstone of conservative thinking and the GOP must find that cornerstone again.

Our founders knew that this dependency, fostered by both the Democrats and the GOP would happen one day. Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton agreed that When the voters recognize that the public treasury has become a public trough, they will send to Washington not persons who will promote self-reliance and foster an atmosphere of prosperity, but rather those who will give away the most cash and thereby create dependency.LINK

I fear it is too late for the GOP to find itself. Mitt Romney was not much better than Barack Obama on this "public trough" way of thinking. I'm not sure that, at this point, the GOP will be much different than the Democratic Party once it "finds itself" because I feel that the true conservative way of thinking, that of self-reliance has gone the way of the dinosaur and will never return.

So we might as well all hop on the wagon and hope that there is someone or something to pull that wagon into the future.
​

 

[Union_Jack_1972]

I agree that the GOP must find its soul again. True conservatism embraces everyone. There is nothing wrong with true conservatism - a belief that we are all in charge of our own destiny and that our own hard work should propel us into success and that the government is not needed to send us money or control our daily lives (what we eat, what we drive, how warm or cool we keep our homes, what we think). Self-reliance is the cornerstone of conservative thinking and the GOP must find that cornerstone again.

Our founders knew that this dependency, fostered by both the Democrats and the GOP would happen one day. Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton agreed that When the voters recognize that the public treasury has become a public trough, they will send to Washington not persons who will promote self-reliance and foster an atmosphere of prosperity, but rather those who will give away the most cash and thereby create dependency.LINK

I fear it is too late for the GOP to find itself. Mitt Romney was not much better than Barack Obama on this "public trough" way of thinking. I'm not sure that, at this point, the GOP will be much different than the Democratic Party once it "finds itself" because I feel that the true conservative way of thinking, that of self-reliance has gone the way of the dinosaur and will never return.

So we might as well all hop on the wagon and hope that there is someone or something to pull that wagon into the future.
​

I understand your point Jen, and feel your pain with the death of true conservatism, but Jen we must also understand that our great Nation has been marching the path of socialism for generations now. The socialistic views of today did not come to birth during Obama time, and the slow painful death of conservatism has been going on for years.

I do wish states had more rights over issues like abortion, healthcare, and dividing issues like them, but as you know the GOP would have done little to correct the course that has been taken. Remember how the left cried about the Patriot Act, and since Obama first election they have grown silent since?

Well the GOP would be the same way with Healthcare, and big government spending, and have been. In the end conservatism died in the 1960's and the last President with any form of Conservatism in his bones was Bill Clinton. So in the end to even dream of a true conservative Candidate or Government would be like someone thinkin' Ron Paul had a real chance of winning the White House this year...

 

[NightSwimmer]

The Republican party came into power after they splitted from the Whig party and shed themselves of the Know Nothing crowd during the 1800's. It is said that they have allowed the racist element back into it fold, and turn the GOP into the 21st century versionof the Know Nothing.

As long as the GOP embraces the radical views of the Tea Party they will be forever a minority party. The Tea party just like the Know Nothing party base their policies on fear, hatred, and racism. They see someone like Obama a threat to the great white society while fearin' the growing number of Hispanic voters that one day will dictate the future elections even more than they do now.

GOP must shed the radical element, move right of center once again, and discover that to win they must embrace new ideals like their dear leaders Lincoln, Roosevelt, and Nixon did. They must understand the day of the majority white is dyin' out in this great nation of our, and if they do not adapt they will fall to the pages of history just like the Know Nothing and Reform Party....

It's too late. If the GOP dumps their Know Nothing base now, then they won't have any remaining members. The sensible folks left the Party long ago.

 

[Jen]

Yes. I am aware that true conservatism left decades ago. I'm ready to march on and I'm fine with that. No digging in of the heels for me. And it's a little too late for the GOP to suddenly find it's conservative roots. Mainstream GOP is no more conservative than the Democratic Party is.

I'll move with the times.

I understand your point Jen, and feel your pain with the death of true conservatism, but Jen we must also understand that our great Nation has been marching the path of socialism for generations now. The socialistic views of today did not come to birth during Obama time, and the slow painful death of conservatism has been going on for years.

I do wish states had more rights over issues like abortion, healthcare, and dividing issues like them, but as you know the GOP would have done little to correct the course that has been taken. Remember how the left cried about the Patriot Act, and since Obama first election they have grown silent since?

Well the GOP would be the same way with Healthcare, and big government spending, and have been. In the end conservatism died in the 1960's and the last President with any form of Conservatism in his bones was Bill Clinton. So in the end to even dream of a true conservative Candidate or Government would be like someone thinkin' Ron Paul had a real chance of winning the White House this year...