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NYT report card for Obama

Genedio

Council Member
Kristof offers a report card for Obama’s first term:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/06/o...irst-term-report-card.html?_r=2&smid=tw-share

I take issue with a lot of it. First, the categories don’t seem to be equal in importance. Economic policy (both fiscal as enacted by Congress and the president, and monetary as enacted by the members of the Federal Reserve he appoints) and foreign policy seem much more important to me than issues which only affect a tiny sliver of the population–such as the Army’s policy towards gays.

On all of these areas but one, I would have given Obama a lower score. Take the economy, where Kristof gives Obama a B. What about the across the board bailout of the TBTF banks and their non-prosecution for fraud? What about Obama’s adding $6 trillion to the national debt? Extending the Bush tax cuts for political reasons (conciliation)? I think Kristof is focusing only on jobs and the fact that Team Obama temporarily averted a depression by kicking the can down the road. I’d give Obama a C here.

Kristof gives Obama an A- on education, but look what has happened with young adults seeking college educations lately. They collectively owe almost $1 trillion, which is more than the total outstanding credit card debt. Many of them graduated or will graduate with worthless degrees from overpriced universities, and will be stuck with unpayable debt for decades. I think the most I’d give here would be a B.

Obama gets a B+ on foreign policy, despite having escalated the Afghanistan occupation, despite probably crossing the line on international law with Libya, maybe with Syria, and certainly with all the drone attacks and the continued torture. I can’t give Obama more than a D here, even though I’ll grant Bush was, and Romney probably would be, worse.

On “Other Domestic Issues”, Kristof failed to mention the NDAA, which allows presidents to unilaterally indefinitely detain those whom he deems to be threats to national security, and incidentally target for assassination. Also he omits any discussion of Obama's escalation against whistle-blowers. I’d have a hard time giving Obama a passing grade here, as he has gone beyond even Bush in this area.

Other areas which Kristof failed to comment on include energy policy, environmental policy, and drug war policy. Obama is overall mediocre in these areas, with a disappointing lack of innovation and creative thinking.

Kristof gives Obama an F on communication. While I agree he has not overall communicated effectively, I wouldn’t say that communication per se is his worst problem. He hasn’t communicated well because he serves two masters (or ostensibly serves one while really serving the other). But I think Carter may have been worse on communication, as he chided the American public and lapsed into sanctimony. Obama hasn't stooped to that yet.

The average of Kristof’s grades, assuming equal weight for each policy area, is about a B-.

I’d give Obama a C-, granting that he was able to push through a flawed healthcare plan, which might be improved some day. But I think Kristof over-values certain things and totally ignores others. Obama is at best a mediocre president, beholden to the biggest banks that bankrolled his campaign in 2008, and alas, one who has continued most of the failed Bush policies. That’s pretty unforgivable.
 
So then, you're one who actually did expect a Messiah? I wondered if any of those folks actually existed. This certainly isn't the dawning of the age of Aquarius, but then, I don't compare my President to an ideal of the perfect Philosopher King -- I compare him to his opponent. That's the only choice that we really get come November, after all.
 
Hey, long time no see! Good to see you here. I hope you stick around. I'd give Obama a B- on domestic policy, a C+ on foreign policy, and a D- on civil liberties. That compares to his predecessor, who'd get a D-, F, and F, respectively. So, if we take Romney's campaign rhetoric seriously -- assuming that he will, as indicated, differ from George W. Bush in no major policy particulars, then the choice this November is easy.
 
Very fair post. Kudos

Kristof offers a report card for Obama’s first term:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/06/o...irst-term-report-card.html?_r=2&smid=tw-share

I take issue with a lot of it. First, the categories don’t seem to be equal in importance. Economic policy (both fiscal as enacted by Congress and the president, and monetary as enacted by the members of the Federal Reserve he appoints) and foreign policy seem much more important to me than issues which only affect a tiny sliver of the population–such as the Army’s policy towards gays.

On all of these areas but one, I would have given Obama a lower score. Take the economy, where Kristof gives Obama a B. What about the across the board bailout of the TBTF banks and their non-prosecution for fraud? What about Obama’s adding $6 trillion to the national debt? Extending the Bush tax cuts for political reasons (conciliation)? I think Kristof is focusing only on jobs and the fact that Team Obama temporarily averted a depression by kicking the can down the road. I’d give Obama a C here.

Kristof gives Obama an A- on education, but look what has happened with young adults seeking college educations lately. They collectively owe almost $1 trillion, which is more than the total outstanding credit card debt. Many of them graduated or will graduate with worthless degrees from overpriced universities, and will be stuck with unpayable debt for decades. I think the most I’d give here would be a B.

Obama gets a B+ on foreign policy, despite having escalated the Afghanistan occupation, despite probably crossing the line on international law with Libya, maybe with Syria, and certainly with all the drone attacks and the continued torture. I can’t give Obama more than a D here, even though I’ll grant Bush was, and Romney probably would be, worse.

On “Other Domestic Issues”, Kristof failed to mention the NDAA, which allows presidents to unilaterally indefinitely detain those whom he deems to be threats to national security, and incidentally target for assassination. Also he omits any discussion of Obama's escalation against whistle-blowers. I’d have a hard time giving Obama a passing grade here, as he has gone beyond even Bush in this area.

Other areas which Kristof failed to comment on include energy policy, environmental policy, and drug war policy. Obama is overall mediocre in these areas, with a disappointing lack of innovation and creative thinking.

Kristof gives Obama an F on communication. While I agree he has not overall communicated effectively, I wouldn’t say that communication per se is his worst problem. He hasn’t communicated well because he serves two masters (or ostensibly serves one while really serving the other). But I think Carter may have been worse on communication, as he chided the American public and lapsed into sanctimony. Obama hasn't stooped to that yet.

The average of Kristof’s grades, assuming equal weight for each policy area, is about a B-.

I’d give Obama a C-, granting that he was able to push through a flawed healthcare plan, which might be improved some day. But I think Kristof over-values certain things and totally ignores others. Obama is at best a mediocre president, beholden to the biggest banks that bankrolled his campaign in 2008, and alas, one who has continued most of the failed Bush policies. That’s pretty unforgivable.
 
Hey, long time no see! Good to see you here. I hope you stick around. I'd give Obama a B- on domestic policy, a C+ on foreign policy, and a D- on civil liberties. That compares to his predecessor, who'd get a D-, F, and F, respectively. So, if we take Romney's campaign rhetoric seriously -- assuming that he will, as indicated, differ from George W. Bush in no major policy particulars, then the choice this November is easy.

So,what kind of grade would you give Congress Arkady? Enquiring minds would like to know.
 
Care to quibble with my actual assessments? Or will you just revert to the tired old 'he's the lesser of two evils' stance?

Bush was an "F" president. Clinton a "B" president. Bush senior another "C-minus" president like Obama. Reagan earned a 'gentleman's C', just as he did when he attended his third-rate university. Carter, despite his sanctimonious mien, probably was a C+ president...as was Ford. Nixon was another C-minus.

The report card for American presidents over the last four decades is pretty piss-poor, and doesn't augur well for our future.

It's not about messaihas, but about electing (or re-electing) competent and reasonably just people to the office.

Romney would likely be a D president, but could be an F or a C president. The difference is statistically insignificant.
 
Care to quibble with my actual assessments? Or will you just revert to the tired old 'he's the lesser of two evils' stance?

I don't really see the point. You're welcome to your opinions, regardless of their objective accuracy.

I'm not an idealist, I'm a pragmatist. I'll vote for "the lesser of two evils" or "the greater of two goods" -- either way you choose to look at it. The Philosopher King won't be on the ballot. Neither will you.
 
President Ron Paul? Despite liking some of his stance (ending the wars/drug wars, reining in the Federal Reserve) and being somewhat lukewarm at best about his sink or swim attitude towards the tens of millions of people who are pretty desperate by now, I don't really think he's the right man for the job. Too old, too marginalized, a bit quirky if not crackpot, I don't think he could sell his revolutionary ideas...even the better ones. I might prefer Gary Johnson among Republicans, and definitely Jill Stein among Greens, even if I doubt the country is ready for her just yet. But this status quo of kicking the can down the road and pleasing the elites while papering over the losses with new debt ain't working.
 
LeRoy: Hi, Genedio. Good to see you here. As you might guess, I differ with some of your grades. Overall, I'd give recent Presidents the following grades:

Ronald Reagan: D
George H.W. Bush: C-
Bill Clinton: B+
George W. Bush: F
Barack Obama: B-, maybe a C+, on the borderline.

I.e., I see Obama as being a slightly above average President. I note that The Economist in its most recent issue had a similar report card on Obama. They gave him an A on economic crisis management. Their grades were lower in other areas dealing with the economy, though. I left my copy of the issue at home, will have to retrieve it, or look it up online.

I strongly suspect that Rmoney (I always accidently misspell his name) would be an 'F' President; as I told Arkady the other day, he might even be worse than George W. Bush, especially if he implemented (or really tried to) the Ryan 'plan'. Ezra Klein said the Ryan plan would make the Hoover economy look like 'the good old days'. Can't get much more blunt than that.

Obama does get an F in a few areas, like drug war policy. He gets a C- in communication from me. I rate him as better than you do on energy policy. Against fervent and feverish opposition from the Republicans, tied to fossil fuel industry interests as they are, Obama is valiantly trying to turn America towards renewable energy resources.

How has Obama 'crossed the line on international law' in Syria? Can you document any instances of "continued torture"?
 
So you're pure libertarian? I mean, with your fondness for Johnson?

No, I'm a mixture of libertarian and progressive. I like both Johnson and Stein (and used to like both Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich--despite their tempermental unsuitability for the presidency). It's the ideas I like, not the personalities, necessarily.
 
So then, you're one who actually did expect a Messiah? I wondered if any of those folks actually existed. This certainly isn't the dawning of the age of Aquarius, but then, I don't compare my President to an ideal of the perfect Philosopher King -- I compare him to his opponent. That's the only choice that we really get come November, after all.

I agree whole-heartedly that the key question right now is how he compares to the only realistic alternative, which is Romney. Unless one thinks the difference between them is so small as to make the immediate outcome of the election relatively meaningless (in which case one is free to maneuver for the long-term, however one see fit), one is forced to vote for the lesser of the two evils. I think the difference between them is relatively large. With Romney, we'd likely waste an extra hundred billion or so on the military, at least, per year, even if he doesn't get us into a war with Iran. With Romney we're also more likely to get more upper-class tax cuts, devastating our nation fiscally. I can also foresee more erosion of the separation of church and state on Romney's watch, and more neglect of long-term investments (education, infrastructure, and R&D). So, my choice is clear.

That said, I don't think it's fair to suggest that Genedio is waiting for a philosopher king. The tone of his criticism of Obama is commensurate with the gap between Obama and what a reasonable person might expect from a good real-world Democrat. As I've argued here before, I think a very strong case can be made that Obama has governed to the right of where Clinton governed, and Clinton himself was sometimes accused of being a DINO (Democrat in Name Only). In fact, I've read fairly convincing analyses suggesting that, in practice, Obama's policies sit to the right of those of some modern Republican presidents, at least on economic issues (Eisenhower, Nixon, and GHW Bush, for example). He has, for example, lowered overall taxes even farther below a level that Ike and Nixon would have considered amazingly low to begin with. And he has openly embraced policies (like indefinite detentions without trial) that would have been beyond the pale not so long ago.

There isn't just a big gap between Obama and some messianic Philosopher King of our imaginations. On economic policies, there's a big gap between him and at least three modern real-world Democrats (FDR and his New Deal, Truman and his Fair Deal, and Johnson and his Great Society).
 
Bush senior another "C-minus" president like Obama. Reagan earned a 'gentleman's C',

There's no way I'd score Reagan above Bush senior. I have no love for the elder Bush (he suggested atheists like me weren't even Americans, which is such vile bigotry that if he'd said it about Jews his career would have been over and he'd have lived in infamy after that). But, overall, he was pretty competent. He forged a strong coalition to oust Hussein from Kuwait on the cheap, and then had the wisdom to stop there. He allowed some minor improvements to environmental protections. And he bravely took a big political hit in order to increase revenues, in the face of massive deficits. He even presided over the closing of a lot of useless military bases, cutting our military waste. I also think he handled the endgame of the Cold War deftly -- there were some moments that could have gone differently in the critical weeks when the hard-liner communists and Yeltsin were maneuvering against each other.

Reagan deserves some credit for reversing himself on the Soviet Union and actually negotiating with Gorbachev in good faith. And he deserves a whole lot of credit for keeping us out of any significant military conflict for eight long years, which is looking like an increasingly extraordinary feat. But he was an absolute nightmare for our fiscal situation, and also terrible for our social situation (violent crime soared, finally hitting an all-time peak part-way into GHW Bush's presidency). His "war on drugs" backfired terribly and remade us into a kind of prison state. And, more than any other politician in a century, he poisoned the political well. He may not have been the absolutist right-winger the Republicans of today remember, but he played one on TV, and helped to calcify that as their ideal, and we've all been paying for it. I'd give him a D, at best.
 
No President gets to start with a clean slate, and no President (regardless of his ideals) has the power to force his will upon Congress. The best that we can hope for is to have a President who understands how best to expend his political capital in pursuing real change. Our system is not designed to allow overnight changes in policy. Progress is always excruciatingly slow in coming.

I could nitpick anyone to pieces, if I set about to do so, but what would I have proved by doing that? If I truly felt that I could do a better job, then I'd be running for office myself, rather than nitpicking those who are running.

As I've grown older, I've learned to take a longer view regarding politics. I'll take slow movement in the right direction over slow movement in the wrong direction every time. That's as good as it gets.
 
So,what kind of grade would you give Congress Arkady? Enquiring minds would like to know.

It's tough to grade Congress as a whole, since it's not an individual or even a team. For practical purposes, it's two competing teams, so giving then one shared grade is a little odd -- like scoring both teams at the Super Bowl with one grade. But, if I were forced to do so, I'd say that in 2009 and 2010, they get a B (ARRA and Affordable Care were both deeply flawed, but still historical accomplishments, and they also passed a lot of smaller protections and assistance for the American people in time of crisis), and since then they've earned an F (they've done almost nothing in the last two years, except scare the crap out of global markets by threatening to have America not pay its debts).
 
Hi, Leroy. I gave Ronald Reagan a gentleman's C because he got the United States into no major war (though his minor proxy wars were rather despicable--but the same could be said about most of our proxy wars and occupations). Reagan did make a deal with Gorbachev which at least potentially might have ended the Cold War, had the neocons not taken over. Reagan's economy was built on steroids (tax cuts out the kazoo), but he did not debase the currency, and enjoyed the strongest performance after Clinton's. Reagan's environmental and energy policy (remember James Watt?) was as bad as Bush's. I think Reagan lucked out, and incidentally did a good thing with the Russians. True, that was after he wasted billions on Star Wars and other follies.

A gentleman's C probably equates to a C-minus or D+ by anyone else's reckoning. I think a D is too low, given his economy.

I think a B+ is too high for Clinton, given what we now know about the effects of his deregulation of media ownership, and especially the repeal of Glass-Steagall that occurred in the last year of his administration. The Rubinites indeed did a lot of damage, and are still doing damage today in Obama's admin.

I could never agree with The Economist that Obama deserves an A for "crisis management" in handling the financial crisis. Obama gave into the big banks and holding companies (Goldman, Morgan Stanley, JP Morgan, etc.). This was just wrong. Obama evidently feared that by investigating what went wrong, he would unravel the thread of credibility, and bring the whole system down. Thus, fraud was not investigated, let alone prosecuted. This is a stain on his presidency, and will haunt us until it is resolved. Of course Obama was not uniquely guilty here, but played along. Perhaps it was too much to expect of a green (as in newbie) president that he would face this problem squarely. So, the Dow has doubled since March, 2009? It's all smoke and mirrors built on easy money from Uncle Ben and accounting forbearance--if not creative accounting. That doesn't earn an A. Shame on the pimply eggheads at The Economist.

I agree that Rmoney may try a radical Ryan approach, but if it leads to Hooverite conditions, he'd be out on his ass in 2016, and then we might get some real people-oriented reform. But with Obama in office, the Democrats have been leaning right--just as in the old Cream song, Politician ("I support the left, though I'm leaning, leaning to the right").
 
Vote for Nader. That'll teach all of those dumbass Americans a lesson. Then, after everyone learns their lesson, we can finally create Utopia here on Earth.

Been there, done that. Don't want the freakin' tee shirt.
 
So you're pure libertarian? I mean, with your fondness for Johnson?

I can't speak for Genedio, but I don't think you have to be a pure libertarian to have some fondness for Johnson, at this moment. You can simply see him as a badly flawed politician who, notwithstanding those flaws, has strengths in the places we happen to need them right now. If you think some of our biggest issues are our wasteful military spending, foreign wars, eroded civil liberties, government secrecy, and drug prohibition, for example, you might want to see four years of Johnson as a bit of a corrective. It's like eating nothing but Saltines when you've got the flu and have been puking your guts out -- a long-term diet of nothing but Saltines would be deadly, but it might be a sensible short-term choice when anything more could just make your condition worse.

I'm not endorsing Johnson even for the short-term. I think he'd be worse than Obama, despite being a nice corrective on some of Obama's worst behavior (like his government opacity, his ramping up of the drug war, his unauthorized use of force in Libya, etc.) I'm just saying I can see how a reasonable person might disagree, at this point. If the election were between Obama and Johnson, some good, smart, well-meaning, informed, and patriotic citizens would be voting for Johnson. I can't, on the other hand, see how any reasonable person could vote for Romney, and he's the actual opponent this year.
 
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