Selected before Elected?

[Boca]

The last proposed Constitutional Amendment to Article 2, Section 1 regarding "natural born" eligibility was in 1977. But twenty-six years later on June 11, 2003 there began a series of attempts.

Democrat Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduced H.J.R 59: in the 108th Congress –

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and who has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

September 3, 2003: Rep. John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 67:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the office of President."

September 15, 2004: Rep. Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introduced H.J.R. 104:

"Constitutional Amendment – "Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

January 4, 2005: Rep John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 2: to the 109th Congress

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the Office of President."


February 1, 2005: Rep Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introducesd H.J.R. 15:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

April 14, 2005: Rep Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduces H.J.R. 42:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and whos has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

Co-sponsors of these various bills included
Rep Conyers, John, Jr. [MI-14]
Rep Delahunt, William D. [MA-10]
Rep Frank, Barney [MA-4]
Rep Issa, Darrell E. [CA-49]
Rep LaHood, Ray [IL-18]
Rep Shays, Christopher [CT-4]
Rep Sherman, Brad [CA-27]

None of the above bills made it out of Committee. However just the attempts teach us two things.

1) There was a concerted effort on the part of some members of Congress from 2003 into the spring of 2005, coincident with the rise of Barack Hussein Obama's political star, to amend the Constitution to eliminate the natural born citizen requirement. The last attempt being 26 years earlier in 1977.

2) Some members of Congress either believed or had knowledge that Barack Obama was not eligible, contrary to the belief of many here and many in the general public..


With an unconsittutional candidate on the Democrat ticket Democrat Senator Claire McCaskill, [MO] tries to attach the alteration to a military bill in S.2678: on February 28, 2008.

"Children of Military Families Natural Born Citizen Act – Declares that the term "natural born Citizen" in article II, section 1, clause 5 of the Constitution, dealing with the criteria for election to President of the United States, includes any person born to any U.S. citizen while serving in the active or reserve components of the U.S. armed forces."

That failed as well.

So on April 10, 2008, unable to alter or remove the natural born citizen requirement after five years of effort, in a thinly disguised effort to shift the media's focus and the nation's focus, Senator Claire McCaskill introduced S.R.511.

A resolution declaring Sen. John McCain a "natural born citizen" eligible to run for and hold the office of president, even when there was no doubt that John McCain was a natural born citizen. Interestingly Senator Barack Obama was a co-sponsor of that Resolution.

Far more interesting is the text of S.R. 511 which concludes with....

Whereas John Sidney McCain, III, was born to American citizens on an American military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936: Now, therefore, be it Resolved, That John Sidney McCain, III, is a `natural born Citizen' under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.

Please note the Resolution itself specifies "American citizens", plural. The very requirement stipulated in the Constitution that Barack Obama does not meet.

 

[as seen on tv]

i dont think the amendments offered before 2008 have anything to do with obama.

in fact, amendments offered in the early 2,000's by republican dana rohrbacker appear to have had arnold schwarznegger in mind . . .

 

[Craig]

The last proposed Constitutional Amendment to Article 2, Section 1 regarding "natural born" eligibility was in 1977. But twenty-six years later on June 11, 2003 there began a series of attempts.

Democrat Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduced H.J.R 59: in the 108th Congress –

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and who has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

September 3, 2003: Rep. John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 67:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the office of President."

September 15, 2004: Rep. Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introduced H.J.R. 104:

"Constitutional Amendment – "Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

January 4, 2005: Rep John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 2: to the 109th Congress

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the Office of President."


February 1, 2005: Rep Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introducesd H.J.R. 15:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

April 14, 2005: Rep Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduces H.J.R. 42:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and whos has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

Co-sponsors of these various bills included
Rep Conyers, John, Jr. [MI-14]
Rep Delahunt, William D. [MA-10]
Rep Frank, Barney [MA-4]
Rep Issa, Darrell E. [CA-49]
Rep LaHood, Ray [IL-18]
Rep Shays, Christopher [CT-4]
Rep Sherman, Brad [CA-27]

None of the above bills made it out of Committee. However just the attempts teach us two things.

1) There was a concerted effort on the part of some members of Congress from 2003 into the spring of 2005, coincident with the rise of Barack Hussein Obama's political star, to amend the Constitution to eliminate the natural born citizen requirement. The last attempt being 26 years earlier in 1977.

2) Some members of Congress either believed or had knowledge that Barack Obama was not eligible, contrary to the belief of many here and many in the general public..


With an unconsittutional candidate on the Democrat ticket Democrat Senator Claire McCaskill, [MO] tries to attach the alteration to a military bill in S.2678: on February 28, 2008.
"Children of Military Families Natural Born Citizen Act – Declares that the term "natural born Citizen" in article II, section 1, clause 5 of the Constitution, dealing with the criteria for election to President of the United States, includes any person born to any U.S. citizen while serving in the active or reserve components of the U.S. armed forces."

That failed as well.

So on April 10, 2008, unable to alter or remove the natural born citizen requirement after five years of effort, in a thinly disguised effort to shift the media's focus and the nation's focus, Senator Claire McCaskill introduced S.R.511.

A resolution declaring Sen. John McCain a "natural born citizen" eligible to run for and hold the office of president, even when there was no doubt that John McCain was a natural born citizen. Interestingly Senator Barack Obama was a co-sponsor of that Resolution.

Far more interesting is the text of S.R. 511 which concludes with....

Whereas John Sidney McCain, III, was born to American citizens on an American military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936: Now, therefore, be it Resolved, That John Sidney McCain, III, is a `natural born Citizen' under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.

Please note the Resolution itself specifies "American citizens", plural. The very requirement stipulated in the Constitution that Barack Obama does not meet.

Ahnold and Granholm were the targets...because they were not born here.

...Because Mr. Hatch and Austrian-born Arnold Schwarzenegger, the soon-to-be California governor, are said to be close friends, the senator’s measure has been skeptically dubbed the Schwarzenegger amendment. But the amendment is no respecter of political parties. It would equally affect the career options of Jennifer Granholm, the Canadian-born Democratic governor of Michigan. Moreover, the interest in making foreign-born citizens eligible for the presidency is bipartisan. In the House, Arkansas Democratic Rep. Vic Snyder has proposed an amendment similar to Mr. Hatch’s.

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2003/nov/12/20031112-093409-8265r/#ixzz3VzL2xDRo
Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter

 

[Boca]

i dont think the amendments offered before 2008 have anything to do with obama.

in fact, amendments offered in the early 2,000's by republican dana rohrbacker appear to have had arnold schwarznegger in mind . . .

Before 2008? How do you suppose they were going to get an amendment ratified by 34 states in a few months?

I agree with you Rohrbacker.

 

[Boca]

Ahnold and Granholm were the targets...because they were not born here.

You may be right but I'd like to see the citizenship status of their parents at the time of their birth.

Anyway

From the Times article you linked to from 2003....

Notably, even as they reserved the presidency for naturalized citizens [ wrong, they reserved the presidency for natural born citizens] the Framers refused to make that reservation absolute [wrong again, it was absolute upon adoption of Constitution], since they made eligible for the office immigrants who were already American citizens in 1787. [wrong again, there were no natural born citizens of the United States before there was a United States, which was established by the ratified and adopted Constitution on June 21, 1788.

Article 2 Section 1

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

"....or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President."

Makes a lot of sense since there were no natural born citizens at the time of adoption and we couldn't wait around 35 years before one became eligible.

From your post...

Moreover, the interest in making foreign-born citizens eligible for the presidency is bipartisan.

Until the Constitution is amended bi-partisan interest doesn't matter one bit.

On June 21,1788 New Hampshire became the 9th state of the 13 states to ratify the new Constitution and the United States was officially established.

On April 30, 1789 George Washington was inaugurated as President.

 

[Arkady]

The last proposed Constitutional Amendment to Article 2, Section 1 regarding "natural born" eligibility was in 1977. But twenty-six years later on June 11, 2003 there began a series of attempts.

Democrat Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduced H.J.R 59: in the 108th Congress –

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and who has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

September 3, 2003: Rep. John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 67:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the office of President."

September 15, 2004: Rep. Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introduced H.J.R. 104:

"Constitutional Amendment – "Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

January 4, 2005: Rep John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 2: to the 109th Congress

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the Office of President."


February 1, 2005: Rep Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introducesd H.J.R. 15:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

April 14, 2005: Rep Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduces H.J.R. 42:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and whos has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

Co-sponsors of these various bills included
Rep Conyers, John, Jr. [MI-14]
Rep Delahunt, William D. [MA-10]
Rep Frank, Barney [MA-4]
Rep Issa, Darrell E. [CA-49]
Rep LaHood, Ray [IL-18]
Rep Shays, Christopher [CT-4]
Rep Sherman, Brad [CA-27]

None of the above bills made it out of Committee. However just the attempts teach us two things.

1) There was a concerted effort on the part of some members of Congress from 2003 into the spring of 2005, coincident with the rise of Barack Hussein Obama's political star, to amend the Constitution to eliminate the natural born citizen requirement. The last attempt being 26 years earlier in 1977.

2) Some members of Congress either believed or had knowledge that Barack Obama was not eligible, contrary to the belief of many here and many in the general public..


With an unconsittutional candidate on the Democrat ticket Democrat Senator Claire McCaskill, [MO] tries to attach the alteration to a military bill in S.2678: on February 28, 2008.

"Children of Military Families Natural Born Citizen Act – Declares that the term "natural born Citizen" in article II, section 1, clause 5 of the Constitution, dealing with the criteria for election to President of the United States, includes any person born to any U.S. citizen while serving in the active or reserve components of the U.S. armed forces."

That failed as well.

So on April 10, 2008, unable to alter or remove the natural born citizen requirement after five years of effort, in a thinly disguised effort to shift the media's focus and the nation's focus, Senator Claire McCaskill introduced S.R.511.

A resolution declaring Sen. John McCain a "natural born citizen" eligible to run for and hold the office of president, even when there was no doubt that John McCain was a natural born citizen. Interestingly Senator Barack Obama was a co-sponsor of that Resolution.

Far more interesting is the text of S.R. 511 which concludes with....

Whereas John Sidney McCain, III, was born to American citizens on an American military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936: Now, therefore, be it Resolved, That John Sidney McCain, III, is a `natural born Citizen' under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.

Please note the Resolution itself specifies "American citizens", plural. The very requirement stipulated in the Constitution that Barack Obama does not meet.

In 2003, Obama was a nobody -- a member of the Illinois State Senate that few outside of Illinois had heard of. He didn't rise to prominence until July 2004. What happened in the Fall of 2003 is that Arnold Schwarzenegger, who is ineligible to be president because he wasn't born a US citizen, became governor of our largest state. That put the issue of citizenship and the presidency into the news.

 

[Boca]

In 2003, Obama was a nobody -- a member of the Illinois State Senate that few outside of Illinois had heard of. He didn't rise to prominence until July 2004. What happened in the Fall of 2003 is that Arnold Schwarzenegger, who is ineligible to be president because he wasn't born a US citizen, became governor of our largest state. That put the issue of citizenship and the presidency into the news.

Really.....John Conyers, Barney Frank, and Delahunt were trying to open the door for Schwarzenegger?

And about this Obama prominence thing. I suppose you're referring to making a speech at the Democrat convention right? Yeah that would be general public prominence for sure. Seems as though a "nobody" had to have something going for him to get the invitation in the first place wouldn't you think? Remember, the title of the post is Selected before Elected.

 

[Arkady]

Really.....John Conyers, Barney Frank, and Delahunt were trying to open the door for Schwarzenegger?

They were trying to open it because they didn't like to see newer Americans discriminated against. It's just that the rise of Schwarzennegger made for a rare opportunity to possibly advance the issue, since customary right-wing xenophobia might be overwhelmed by short-term interest in a particular politician.

Seems as though a "nobody" had to have something going for him to get the invitation in the first place wouldn't you think?

Absolutely. He was a skilled and charismatic speaker. That was known to party insiders. But I'd never heard of the guy until he took the podium, and I doubt many outside of Illinois had. The party, of course, was also interested in diversifying the speakers at the convention. It was the same impulse that had caused them to name Harold Ford to be the keynote speaker eight years earlier. But that didn't mean that Harold Ford had somehow been chosen to be our next president. It was just thought that it would help solidify the base while giving some exposure to a possible future star of the party.

 

[Boca]

Absolutely. He was a skilled and charismatic speaker. That was known to party insiders.

Good...I'm glad we agree. Everything falls into place then doesn't it?

He came to the attention of party insiders in 2003. They lined him up to showcase himself at the convention and he sparkled

And in June, 2003 Democrat Vic Snyder got the ball rolling with H.J.R 59: in the 108th Congress.

Next up was John Conyers introducing H.J.R 67 in September just three months later.

Then again in January, 2005 Conyers tries again with H.J.R. 2.

Three months later in April Vic Snyder takes another shot at it with H.J.R. 42.

So why would they do that if Obama had a clean bill of health as an eligible citizen? Certainly not for Schwarzenegger.

Nope, they had good reason to...there was this pamphlet from his publisher



And this from a Kenyan newspaper....



And there was also Obama's response to Alan Keyes ( I think it was him); when challenged on his citizenship by Keyes in a debate , Obama shrugged it off saying he wasn't running for President. A tacit admission he wasn't eligible.

It is what is though isn't it?

 

[Arkady]

Good...I'm glad we agree. Everything falls into place then doesn't it?

He came to the attention of party insiders in 2003. They lined him up to showcase himself at the convention and he sparkled

And in June, 2003 Democrat Vic Snyder got the ball rolling with H.J.R 59: in the 108th Congress.

Next up was John Conyers introducing H.J.R 67 in September just three months later.

Then again in January, 2005 Conyers tries again with H.J.R. 2.

Three months later in April Vic Snyder takes another shot at it with H.J.R. 42.

So why would they do that if Obama had a clean bill of health as an eligible citizen? Certainly not for Schwarzenegger.

Nope, they had good reason to...there was this pamphlet from his publisher



And this from a Kenyan newspaper....



And there was also Obama's response to Alan Keyes ( I think it was him); when challenged on his citizenship by Keyes in a debate , Obama shrugged it off saying he wasn't running for President. A tacit admission he wasn't eligible.

It is what is though isn't it?

Can you find a link to that exchange with Keyes?

 

[Boca]

Can you find a link to that exchange with Keyes?

I probably could. For you, I don't think so. Anybody that relies on that is never gonna be satisfied anyway. Why bother?

If you actually gave a damn, as an accomplished lawyer seeking truth and only the truth, I'd think you could do it for yourself.

As for me, I don't really give a shit.

 

[BitterPill]

The last proposed Constitutional Amendment to Article 2, Section 1 regarding "natural born" eligibility was in 1977. But twenty-six years later on June 11, 2003 there began a series of attempts.

Democrat Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduced H.J.R 59: in the 108th Congress –

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and who has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

September 3, 2003: Rep. John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 67:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the office of President."

September 15, 2004: Rep. Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introduced H.J.R. 104:

"Constitutional Amendment – "Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

January 4, 2005: Rep John Conyers [MI] introduced H.J.R. 2: to the 109th Congress

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 20 years eligible to hold the Office of President."


February 1, 2005: Rep Dana Rohrabacher [CA-46] introducesd H.J.R. 15:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes eligible for the Office of the President non-native born persons who have held U.S. citizenship for at least 20 years and who are otherwise eligible to hold such Office."

April 14, 2005: Rep Vic Snyder [AR-2] introduces H.J.R. 42:

"Constitutional Amendment – Makes a person who has been a citizen of the United States for at least 35 years and whos has been a resident within the United States for at least 14 years eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President."

Co-sponsors of these various bills included
Rep Conyers, John, Jr. [MI-14]
Rep Delahunt, William D. [MA-10]
Rep Frank, Barney [MA-4]
Rep Issa, Darrell E. [CA-49]
Rep LaHood, Ray [IL-18]
Rep Shays, Christopher [CT-4]
Rep Sherman, Brad [CA-27]

None of the above bills made it out of Committee. However just the attempts teach us two things.

1) There was a concerted effort on the part of some members of Congress from 2003 into the spring of 2005, coincident with the rise of Barack Hussein Obama's political star, to amend the Constitution to eliminate the natural born citizen requirement. The last attempt being 26 years earlier in 1977.

2) Some members of Congress either believed or had knowledge that Barack Obama was not eligible, contrary to the belief of many here and many in the general public..


With an unconsittutional candidate on the Democrat ticket Democrat Senator Claire McCaskill, [MO] tries to attach the alteration to a military bill in S.2678: on February 28, 2008.

"Children of Military Families Natural Born Citizen Act – Declares that the term "natural born Citizen" in article II, section 1, clause 5 of the Constitution, dealing with the criteria for election to President of the United States, includes any person born to any U.S. citizen while serving in the active or reserve components of the U.S. armed forces."

That failed as well.

So on April 10, 2008, unable to alter or remove the natural born citizen requirement after five years of effort, in a thinly disguised effort to shift the media's focus and the nation's focus, Senator Claire McCaskill introduced S.R.511.

A resolution declaring Sen. John McCain a "natural born citizen" eligible to run for and hold the office of president, even when there was no doubt that John McCain was a natural born citizen. Interestingly Senator Barack Obama was a co-sponsor of that Resolution.

Far more interesting is the text of S.R. 511 which concludes with....

Whereas John Sidney McCain, III, was born to American citizens on an American military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936: Now, therefore, be it Resolved, That John Sidney McCain, III, is a `natural born Citizen' under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.

Please note the Resolution itself specifies "American citizens", plural. The very requirement stipulated in the Constitution that Barack Obama does not meet.

Obama was born in Hawai'i, so he meets that constitutional requirement.

 

[Boca]

Obama was born in Hawai'i, so he meets that constitutional requirement.

Obviously you didn't read through the thread. Or didn't grasp the point being made.

If I may intrude into your protective bubble for just a sec...the point was the DNC didn't buy into his eligibility either or they wouldn't have spent five years trying to get Article 2 Section 1 Clause 5 of the Constitution thrown out or amended.

And by the way, it doesn't have a damn thing to do with where he was born! No point trying to explain that to you. Might as well go try to Baptize my daughter's cat again

 

[BitterPill]

Obviously you didn't read through the thread. Or didn't grasp the point being made.

If I may intrude into your protective bubble for just a sec...the point was the DNC didn't buy into his eligibility either or they wouldn't have spent five years trying to get Article 2 Section 1 Clause 5 of the Constitution thrown out or amended.

And by the way, it doesn't have a damn thing to do with where he was born! No point trying to explain that to you. Might as well go try to Baptize my daughter's cat again

Whatever your point is, it is moot since Obama was born in Hawai'i.

Good luck with the cat!

 

[Boca]

Whatever your point is, it is moot since Obama was born in Hawai'i.

Good luck with the cat!

Ignorance is bliss they say. Stick with it.

 

[BitterPill]

Ignorance is bliss they say. Stick with it.

While it is obvious you know what you are talking about, I think I'll pass.

PS How'd the cat come through?

 

[Arkady]

I probably could. For you, I don't think so. Anybody that relies on that is never gonna be satisfied anyway. Why bother?

If you actually gave a damn, as an accomplished lawyer seeking truth and only the truth, I'd think you could do it for yourself.

As for me, I don't really give a shit.

I looked it up. The claims I found referenced the second debate, but the second debate transcript didn't have any such exchange, so I've been unable to substantiate the claim.

 

[Boca]

I looked it up. The claims I found referenced the second debate, but the second debate transcript didn't have any such exchange, so I've been unable to substantiate the claim.

I would imagine it was scrubbed...probably never occurred to you.

 

[Arkady]

I would imagine it was scrubbed...probably never occurred to you.

Yes, it doesn't surprise me that's what you'd imagine. But if it was a televised event, the debate's going to be on YouTube somewhere, and we should be able to find the exchange, if it ever actually happened. If you think it did, feel free to provide a link to the evidence.

 

[Boca]

Yes, it doesn't surprise me that's what you'd imagine. But if it was a televised event, the debate's going to be on YouTube somewhere, and we should be able to find the exchange, if it ever actually happened. If you think it did, feel free to provide a link to the evidence.

Actually I took a few minutes to find a verifiable source myself and couldn't, so it may be it didn't happen?

Please remember though, I mentioned it to show what was making the rounds back then that may have caused Democrats to start making proposals to change the wording of Article 2 Section 1.

I have repeatedly said, and did so in this thread, that where Obama was born is irrelevant.

For some reason an attempt was made by Democrats to amend the Constitution. And it's my contention that reason is he was born a dual-citizen of the United States and Britain and until reached the age of 22 he was a dual-citizen of the United states and Kenya.