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Biden-Hur Transcripts

middleview

President
Supporting Member
\he's playing you..
He's definitely pulling his rhetoric out of communist documents without clearly thinking about what it means. No problem. Such is the nature of much of what is posted on PJ.
In another thread we have boltlady telling us how clever Trump's rant on Easter was.
 

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
He's definitely pulling his rhetoric out of communist documents without clearly thinking about what it means. No problem. Such is the nature of much of what is posted on PJ.
In another thread we have boltlady telling us how clever Trump's rant on Easter was.
..like i said...stylized posturing without an understanding of the realities..

..saw that... and trump can certainly trigger, for true...
 

EatTheRich

President
Of course they can compare...Stalin's holodomor killed 3.9 million people in just Ukraine. Millions more were killed in the Gulag and the executions of anyone considered critical of the government.

Excess mortality in the Soviet Union under Joseph Stalin - Wikipedia
And the Belgian king’s government killed 10 million (3/4 of the population) in the Congo Free State. The Qing dynasty of capitalist China killed 25 million in the Taiping Rebellion reprisals. The Spanish killed 75 million Native Americans. Etc.
 

EatTheRich

President
Lol...cram more 'capitalism' in one passage. That'll get em...
Just keeping you honest … the atrocities in the workers’ state occur within a general milieu of worldwide atrocities. The choice is not between “communist tyranny” and “no communist tyranny” but between the endless tyranny that kills 20 million every year and the use of harsh measures to put an end to that tyranny.
 

EatTheRich

President
Fidel Castro's dark legacy: abuses, draconian rule and 'ruthless suppression

The newly victorious rebels executed hundreds – some say thousands – after seizing power in 1959. Debate still rages over whether this was a legitimate settling of accounts with Fulgencio Batista’s henchmen or kangaroo court-sanctioned atrocities.
Fidel Castro's dark legacy: abuses, draconian rule and 'ruthless suppression' | Fidel Castro | The Guardian
I guess the U.S., which executes hundreds every couple years, a scene of “tyranny and slaughter” extraordinaire.
 

EatTheRich

President

The government continues to repress and punish virtually all forms of dissent and public criticism, as Cubans endure a dire economic crisis affecting their rights.

Authorities responded with brutal, systematic repression and censorship when thousands of Cubans took to the streets in July 2021 to protest the Covid-19 response, scarcity of food and medicines, and long-standing restrictions on rights. Trials of hundreds of such protesters in 2022 often violated basic due process guarantees and resulted in disproportionate prison terms.

Demonstrations across the country continued in 2022, triggered by blackouts, shortages, and deterioration of living conditions.

The government’s repression and apparent unwillingness to address the underlying causes that took people to the streets have forced Cubans to leave the country in unprecedent numbers.

The United States continued a failed policy of isolation towards Cuba, including a decades-long embargo on trade with Cuba.



World Report 2023: Cuba | Human Rights Watch (hrw.org)

Also:

Human rights in Cuba Amnesty International

Cuba arbitrarily abused, arrested protesters, Human Rights Watch states (nbcnews.com)

Cuba: Fidel Castro’s Record of Repression | Human Rights Watch (hrw.org)



Many, many other sources.
Cuba has become considerably more dictatorial in the last 5 years as capitalist socia relations have been reintroduced. I guess after 60 years they started to buckle under the unprecedented relentless pressure.
 

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
Just keeping you honest … the atrocities in the workers’ state occur within a general milieu of worldwide atrocities. The choice is not between “communist tyranny” and “no communist tyranny” but between the endless tyranny that kills 20 million every year and the use of harsh measures to put an end to that tyranny.
Nah, the other way around... There is no such thing as a successful implementation of communism or socialism
 

EatTheRich

President
WTF! How did the western democracies insist on a world war? Your boilerplate rhetoric is a lot of words and little logic. Stalin made war on Poland and Finland...at the same time Britain and France traded away part of Czechoslovakia for "peace in our time"....somehow you interpret their actions as wanting WWII. Did you know Stalin let German troops train on Russian territory and sold raw materials to the Nazis?

By the way...your comment comparing the fascism evident in the governments of several communist nations to labor unions is simply bizarre....Nazi Germany did not allow independent labor unions...neither did Moscow.
The Sudetenland settlement came before the Soviet Union’s preemptive strikes on Poland and Finland, and was motivated in large part (on the part of Britain and France) by the desire to give Hitler a free hand in invading the USSR (as can be confirmed by reading Shirer’s books on France and Germany written at the time). It was under those circumstances that the USSR understandably sought an alliance with Germany that would force France, Britain, and their allies to face the brunt of the Wehrmacht’s first attack. That Stalin achieved that alliance through shameful concessions to Germany is more confirmation of his regime’s reactionary nature.
 

EatTheRich

President
Nah, the other way around... There is no such thing as a successful implementation of communism or socialism
You mean that in 100 years, in the face of trillions spent and millions killed to sabotage every attempt to build socialism, the successes (ending famine in China for example) have been only partial, and the raised standard of living in every workers’ state has not yet resulted in the general triumph of socialist democracy or enabled those countries to catch up to the position that hundreds of years of slavery, plunder, and colonialism have secured for the U.S.
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
And the Belgian king’s government killed 10 million (3/4 of the population) in the Congo Free State. The Qing dynasty of capitalist China killed 25 million in the Taiping Rebellion reprisals. The Spanish killed 75 million Native Americans. Etc.
1. The Belgian slaughter of the people of the Congo ended in 1908.
2. The war between two dynasties in China was in 1850.
3. The Spanish colonization and wars against native populations was in the 1600s....

Are you kidding? Nobody is defending the brutal colonization of the Congo or Latin and South America...likewise, nobody would defend the war between the Native American tribes and the largely European colonists and then the then white population of the country... I wouldn't try to relitigate the Roman wars against the Germanic tribes or the Celts in Britain or the tribal wars in North and South America....

They have nothing to do with the violent communist revolutions of 1917 or 1945 in China. If you want to say that the leaders of the communist movements were as greedy and brutal as the king of Belgium, who am I to argue.
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
This only includes those executed with due process, but 2 people every week are executed without due process by police on the street.
A shootout with police is hardly an execution. It also has zero to do with capitalism. Did you think nobody died at the hands of the Cheka or the NKVD or the KGB?
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
The Sudetenland settlement came before the Soviet Union’s preemptive strikes on Poland and Finland, and was motivated in large part (on the part of Britain and France) by the desire to give Hitler a free hand in invading the USSR (as can be confirmed by reading Shirer’s books on France and Germany written at the time). It was under those circumstances that the USSR understandably sought an alliance with Germany that would force France, Britain, and their allies to face the brunt of the Wehrmacht’s first attack. That Stalin achieved that alliance through shameful concessions to Germany is more confirmation of his regime’s reactionary nature.
The Soviet army was completely unprepared for the German invasion and his war on Finland didn't help. Your constant bending over backwards to excuse the failures of the communist state is beyond logical debate.
 

PhilFish

Administrator
Staff member
The Soviet army was completely unprepared for the German invasion and his war on Finland didn't help. Your constant bending over backwards to excuse the failures of the communist state is beyond logical debate.
Er, the Germans and USSR plotted together (Molotov ribbentrop pact) and invaded. Eerily..the USSR used the same pretext for the invasion of Poland as it did in Ukraine currently... protection of ethnic interests. It was only after Germany turned on them that things changed.
 

EatTheRich

President
1. The Belgian slaughter of the people of the Congo ended in 1908.
2. The war between two dynasties in China was in 1850.
3. The Spanish colonization and wars against native populations was in the 1600s....

Are you kidding? Nobody is defending the brutal colonization of the Congo or Latin and South America...likewise, nobody would defend the war between the Native American tribes and the largely European colonists and then the then white population of the country... I wouldn't try to relitigate the Roman wars against the Germanic tribes or the Celts in Britain or the tribal wars in North and South America....

They have nothing to do with the violent communist revolutions of 1917 or 1945 in China. If you want to say that the leaders of the communist movements were as greedy and brutal as the king of Belgium, who am I to argue.
The Holodomor was in 1930-1933. The Great Leap Forward was 1958-1962. point is that those slaughters were integral to the creation of capitalism as we know it, yet you condemn socialism’s first decades because (being unable to maintain a communist course in the face of unprecedented international pressure) some workers’ states reproduced the same methods of capital accumulation on a more limited scale.
 

EatTheRich

President
The Soviet army was completely unprepared for the German invasion and his war on Finland didn't help. Your constant bending over backwards to excuse the failures of the communist state is beyond logical debate.
The Soviet victory over Finland clearly did help. And would have helped a lot more if not for the blundering of Stalin’s incompetent regime.
 

EatTheRich

President
A shootout with police is hardly an execution. It also has zero to do with capitalism. Did you think nobody died at the hands of the Cheka or the NKVD or the KGB?
The executed seldom shoot back. The systematic terrorizing of the working class in order to assure bourgeois rule has everything to do with capitalism. If you can show such tender solicitude for the torturers executed in 1959-1960, imagine your histrionics were Cubans to be regularly arbitrarily shot by police. That the NKVD and to a considerably more limited extent (as the advance of communism led to the so-called “de-Stalinization” reforms) the KGB carried out mass executions on a larger scale, while Cuba’s DGI/G2 did not, speaks to my point.

But didn’t Lenin’s Cheka, led by faithful Marxist Dzerzhinsky, kill hundreds of thousands? Yes … under the extraordinary conditions of civil war and mass invasion, where the alternative was letting the architects of the death camps and White Terror back into power. The war forced on Lenin’s Russia, by forcing this reliance on secret police methods, helped lay the groundwork for the Stalinist counterrevolution (which therefore relied on the anticommunist right just as I said).
 

middleview

President
Supporting Member
Er, the Germans and USSR plotted together (Molotov ribbentrop pact) and invaded. Eerily..the USSR used the same pretext for the invasion of Poland as it did in Ukraine currently... protection of ethnic interests. It was only after Germany turned on them that things changed.
That is true, but Stalin decided to purge the army at the worst possible time...he dismissed the very generals and senior colonels he needed. That is exactly why the Germans advanced so far into Russia so quickly.
 
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