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The Argument Against Transparency

Arkady

President
Ordinarily, I'm a huge advocate for government transparency. One of my biggest criticisms of the Obama administration is that, after a 2008 campaign in which Obama promised extraordinary transparency, this has been arguably the most opaque administration in history. Not only do they avoid sharing information whenever they can, but they've expanded on the Bush-era abuse of the state secrets doctrine to protect themselves from scrutiny. They've also prosecuted more whistle blowers under espionage laws than all prior administrations combined. However, there's plenty of blame to go around on this. Dishonorable behavior of the Republicans encourages ever-greater stonewalling and obfuscation by the administration, since attempts to communicate openly are routinely used as material for disingenuous attacks.

Probably the most famous recent example is the Republican attempt to take Hillary Clinton's words out of context (and often to rephrase them), in order to make it sound like she was saying it didn't matter that four American died in Benghazi. Of course, only an absolute lunatic or imbecile would have thought that's what she meant, but the conservative movement is packed with lunatics and imbeciles, so it was a fruitful line of propaganda for the Republicans.

Here's another example:

http://www.salon.com/2013/05/20/beltway_plays_scandal_grills_dan_pfeiffer_on_the_word_irrelevant/

A Democrat was making the point that whether or not the IRS activities were illegal, they were wrong and need to be fixed:

"I can’t speak the law — the law here, but the law is irrelevant. The activity was outrageous and inexcusable, and it was stopped and needs to be — we need it to be fixed, so we can ensure it never happens again."

This is a commendable sentiment -- an expression that he won't use "it's technically not illegal" as a way to try to avoid condemning and reforming the practice. But, right-wingers being the breathtakingly dishonorable lot they are, we come away with a new "scandal": that the guy said "the law is irrelevant." When even the most commendable statements are turned into scandal by way of cynical excerpting by Republicans, is it any wonder that the administration resists open dialogue and scrutiny?

As Alex Pareene puts it well:

"The problem, for the White House, is that every word a White House adviser says on TV.... will become part of the great tapestry of allegations that conservatives will make as [the] story continues to churn."
 
As it should be....

This is a perfect Alinksy, Axelrod, Jarret.....blue print... and it works like magic just the way it always did.

The only problem is that this time its aimed at them.

My my....how unfortunate.

Is there theater? Sure...is there overblown drama? Sure there is. Is there a ridiculous amount of emphasis being placed on something that has probably been done before and may even have been somewhat innocent of origin. Yep..

See here's the problem......in order to think on a critical level like that you have to help develop a voter base that is not docile and compliant...that does not respond to one word id commands like food, sex and race. It's kinda like owing a pit bull . Really good pets but not too bright and prone to turn even on the most caring owner sometimes for no apparent reason. But people will own them because they are ferocious and tenacious and nearly unstoppable at times. Burglars fear them! It's just that when they go bad or get misled or for some reason see the owner as a threat...they are just as unstoppable, unreasonable, and ferocious as they would be with a stranger.

The GOP has been steam rolled by this tactic for the past decade...you can hardly blame them for catching on.

JO
 
As it should be....

This is a perfect Alinksy, Axelrod, Jarret.....blue print... and it works like magic just the way it always did.

The only problem is that this time its aimed at them.

My my....how unfortunate.

JO

Oh no...the dreaded "Alinsky"!!! Alinsky was an organizer, not the devil. Politicians of every stripe utilize the techniques. Sometimes they work like a charm, sometimes they don't.


FreedomWorks, the tea party group headed by former Republican House leader Dick Armey, gives copies of “Rules for Radicals” to its leaders. “His tactics when it comes to grass-roots organizing are incredibly effective,”

FreedomWorks spokesman Adam Brandon told The Wall Street Journal. Tea partyers aggressively confronting lawmakers at town hall meetings is straight from Alinsky’s playbook.


Conservative icon William F. Buckley Jr. called the Chicago radical "very close to being an organizational genius."


As a former history professor, Gingrich not only understands Alinsky’s motif, he’s made it a key part of his campaign.

“Gingrich's clashes against the establishment are classic Alinsky,” writes Philip Klein, senior editorial writer for the conservative Washington Examiner...

...“GOP nomination fights are often described as battles between Rockefeller Republicans and Goldwater Republicans,” writes Mr. Klein. “In 2012, Gingrich has brought us the Alinsky Republican.”

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politi...s-Newt-Gingrich-so-obsessed-with-him/(page)/2
 
Virtually every example of Obaman opacity, can be traced to Obaman transparency. The idea that the Obamans are especially opaque, is silly. The only reason we know what the Obamans haven't told us, is because they've TOLD us what they haven't told us.
 
So you're saying it's the Republicans' fault that the Obama administration is secretive and the "most opaque"?

Funny. Seems to me that if their dealings were above-board and honest, they wouldn't have anything to hide in the first place.

Kinda like an innocent criminal suspect.
 
Yes...the Pedophilic Keynes oriented piece of shit...indeed...

U betchya....the right would be remiss not to take up the torch...because ethical or not, moral or not, pretty or not...it is effective for the very reasons elucidated above.

Let's say more..

How this whole thing will predictably play out.

The Gop will thrash...mash and gash this thing for all the mileage it will produce but in no case will they aggressively pursue it to a conclusion. Solving the problem or even finding a culpable person would simply deflate all of that delicious political tension. This is a soap opera of the highest order...it is newsworthy, noteworthy and pervertedly interesting.

Yes indeed....it looks as if the GOP has finally come to the game with a tennis racquet instead of trying to play handball. They have finally figured out how to play an opponent that is unconcerned with fair-play....not that the GOP is either ya know but up till now they have been stuck in the past actually thinking that they could shame their opponents....how foolish of them!

But officer...the other guy was speeding too!

Bwahahahahahaha..


It's too good!
 
As it should be....

This is a perfect Alinksy, Axelrod, Jarret.....blue print... and it works like magic just the way it always did.

The only problem is that this time its aimed at them.

My my....how unfortunate.

Is there theater? Sure...is there overblown drama? Sure there is. Is there a ridiculous amount of emphasis being placed on something that has probably been done before and may even have been somewhat innocent of origin. Yep..

See here's the problem......in order to think on a critical level like that you have to help develop a voter base that is not docile and compliant...that does not respond to one word id commands like food, sex and race. It's kinda like owing a pit bull . Really good pets but not too bright and prone to turn even on the most caring owner sometimes for no apparent reason. But people will own them because they are ferocious and tenacious and nearly unstoppable at times. Burglars fear them! It's just that when they go bad or get misled or for some reason see the owner as a threat...they are just as unstoppable, unreasonable, and ferocious as they would be with a stranger.

The GOP has been steam rolled by this tactic for the past decade...you can hardly blame them for catching on.

JO

I've seen dishonest de-contextualizing of comments from the left, and I try to speak up against it when I see it. But I haven't seen anything as brazen and indefensible as what's going on with the right, lately. Normally, when I see it from the left, what's going on is that a mildly damaging statement, when taken properly in context, is made to sound even worse by isolating it from context that takes some of the edge off. With the right, they're taking statements that aren't even remotely problematic, in context, and they're pretending they're a problem -- creating the scandal from whole cloth, rather than just exaggerating an existing scandal.
 
No he's crying now that the defamation game has come to town with the left in its sights.

Of course they are the ones that nurtured the stupid voting base out there that responds to one word commands...now that they need people to do some critical thinking.....it's not available..

hahahahahah!

I just love watching this!

JO
 
So you're saying it's the Republicans' fault that the Obama administration is secretive and the "most opaque"?

Funny. Seems to me that if their dealings were above-board and honest, they wouldn't have anything to hide in the first place.

Kinda like an innocent criminal suspect.

Think it through. Whenever they try to be forthright, their statements are taken out of context and/or paraphrased inaccurately, in order to create pseudo scandals. So, of course, they'll have a strong urge to "starve the beast," by refusing to give the Republicans more fuel.
 
From the left? How about from career politicians in general.....the left certainly does not own the defamation game its just that the new heights to which this current administration has taken it have only now begun to dawn on the other side.

Washington DC is a shit pit.....no one pretending to hide behind a D or an R for that matter can escape the tarnishing effect of Sodom on the Potomac.

IMO...most of them are insane.

The rise of the occupy groups and of the tea party groups is a precursor to a much larger group of changes coming down the pike.

Term limits should be among the very first of those changes.
 
No he's crying now that the defamation game has come to town with the left in its sights.

Of course they are the ones that nurtured the stupid voting base out there that responds to one word commands...now that they need people to do some critical thinking.....it's not available..

hahahahahah!

I just love watching this!

JO

You're not even attempting to defend the Republican practice. You're just suggesting that the other side did it first. When even the most rabid of conservative boobs can't come up with an actual defense of a Republican practice, it really says something.
 
From the left? How about from career politicians in general.....the left certainly does not own the defamation game its just that the new heights to which this current administration has taken it have only now begun to dawn on the other side.

Washington DC is a shit pit.....no one pretending to hide behind a D or an R for that matter can escape the tarnishing effect of Sodom on the Potomac.

IMO...most of them are insane.

The rise of the occupy groups and of the tea party groups is a precursor to a much larger group of changes coming down the pike.

Term limits should be among the very first of those changes.

I don't believe in term limits. They're just a way of telling the people that they can't vote for whom they want to vote for.
 
You know...there's actually a lot of wisdom in that statement.
The game is one that is higher and more complex than any I have seen played before.

The IRS leak was done at the behest of the administration not against their will...

So you know that the thing they are trying to hide is something that the public knows nothing about ..


YET!

But all beach balls will rise to the surface.....eventually it will come out......probably Benghazi related IMO.

Right now the right wing media is doing Obie's bidding by focusing on the IRS.....

Defame, deflect, misrepresent....lather, rinse, repeat....... Looks like the GOP has figured this game out too.

heh heh ..

JO
 
IMO, their attempts to "starve the beast", as you put it, is what gives the other side fuel to begin with. Don't you see? If the administration's dealings were forthright and honest, the Republicans wouldn't have anything to work with.

This cloak-and-dagger secrecy is what's making people think they've got something to hide....which is exactly what I think, and I don't like it one bit.
 
Had Obama policy for transparency...just like his policy for most everything else, that being doing the opposite of what he says...not been the case..being that when he said transparency he was transparent..we wouldnt be having tis conversation or 90 percent of the conversations we have about Obama. Obama brings this upon himself
 
Ordinarily, I'm a huge advocate for government transparency. One of my biggest criticisms of the Obama administration is that, after a 2008 campaign in which Obama promised extraordinary transparency, this has been arguably the most opaque administration in history. Not only do they avoid sharing information whenever they can, but they've expanded on the Bush-era abuse of the state secrets doctrine to protect themselves from scrutiny. They've also prosecuted more whistle blowers under espionage laws than all prior administrations combined. However, there's plenty of blame to go around on this. Dishonorable behavior of the Republicans encourages ever-greater stonewalling and obfuscation by the administration, since attempts to communicate openly are routinely used as material for disingenuous attacks.

Probably the most famous recent example is the Republican attempt to take Hillary Clinton's words out of context (and often to rephrase them), in order to make it sound like she was saying it didn't matter that four American died in Benghazi. Of course, only an absolute lunatic or imbecile would have thought that's what she meant, but the conservative movement is packed with lunatics and imbeciles, so it was a fruitful line of propaganda for the Republicans.

Here's another example:

http://www.salon.com/2013/05/20/beltway_plays_scandal_grills_dan_pfeiffer_on_the_word_irrelevant/

A Democrat was making the point that whether or not the IRS activities were illegal, they were wrong and need to be fixed:

"I can’t speak the law — the law here, but the law is irrelevant. The activity was outrageous and inexcusable, and it was stopped and needs to be — we need it to be fixed, so we can ensure it never happens again."

This is a commendable sentiment -- an expression that he won't use "it's technically not illegal" as a way to try to avoid condemning and reforming the practice. But, right-wingers being the breathtakingly dishonorable lot they are, we come away with a new "scandal": that the guy said "the law is irrelevant." When even the most commendable statements are turned into scandal by way of cynical excerpting by Republicans, is it any wonder that the administration resists open dialogue and scrutiny?

As Alex Pareene puts it well:

"The problem, for the White House, is that every word a White House adviser says on TV.... will become part of the great tapestry of allegations that conservatives will make as [the] story continues to churn."





It's the old liberal argument: If Republicans do something wrong, it is the fault of the Republicans. If Democrats do something wrong, it is the fault of the Republicans. We should feel sorry for the liberals, because as absurd as that sounds, it is what they believe and will continue to believe. It is the delusion that allows them to live with themselves.
 
A vigilant citizen ought not make arguments for opacity. The contract that our elected officials have with us is not one properly framed as "conditionally honest". You are not speaking here of wartime 'disinformation campaigns', but are actually rationalizing our elected officials holding fast to a culture of concealment.

With all due respect, I frankly can't believe the contortions I witness daily from ostensibly bright and thoughtful people.
 
Arkady,

You are trying to excuse the inexecusable. Sorry but the "he did it first, or he was mean to me" defense doesnt' work in my house with my 4 and 6 year olds. And, sure as hell doesn't hold water when we are talking about educated and experienced public representatives.

connie
 
Arkady,

You are trying to excuse the inexecusable. Sorry but the "he did it first, or he was mean to me" defense doesnt' work in my house with my 4 and 6 year olds. And, sure as hell doesn't hold water when we are talking about educated and experienced public representatives.

connie

I'm not trying to excuse anything. I still think the Obama administration is wrong not to be more transparent. I'm just saying there's blame enough to go around. If you knew there was a well-financed team of partisans who'd happily take your every utterance out of context, in order to claim you'd said outrageous things, wouldn't you be very closed in your communications?
 
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