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The Common Core

Arkady

President
There's a recent push by right-wingers to resist the Common Core standards for education. This is enough to give a person political whiplash, since for decades the conservatives were the ones out front pushing for defined standards in education. But the Common Core, despite the work predating Obama and not being run by the federal government, has become associated with Obama by his support for it, and so now lots of Republicans are against it. Just as Obama's support for the Romneycare/Heritage Foundation conservative healthcare reform made that poisonous for those whose political principles are defined in opposition to whatever Obama supports, now a conservative's dream education reform is in danger of becoming something the GOP unites against.

I just want to take a moment to talk up one advantage of the Common Core. It sets out a schedule for education that would be followed in all states. If you're learning fractions in Texas in fourth grade, they're learning them in New York that year, too. This is extremely valuable for people who move -- for example, the children of our military personnel, who often get reassigned to new states every two or three years. That was my experience growing up. What happens when schedules are set haphazardly by state is that students in my situation will cover the same material two or three times as they move around, growing extremely bored, while other material they'll miss entirely, leaving them at a loss when the material is needed for later study. I might get long division three times but never learn complex fractions, or get three units on the Civil War, but never one about the Revolutionary War. State control of such matters is absurdly inefficient in an increasingly national economy and society.
 
There's a recent push by right-wingers to resist the Common Core standards for education. This is enough to give a person political whiplash, since for decades the conservatives were the ones out front pushing for defined standards in education. But the Common Core, despite the work predating Obama and not being run by the federal government, has become associated with Obama by his support for it, and so now lots of Republicans are against it. Just as Obama's support for the Romneycare/Heritage Foundation conservative healthcare reform made that poisonous for those whose political principles are defined in opposition to whatever Obama supports, now a conservative's dream education reform is in danger of becoming something the GOP unites against.

I just want to take a moment to talk up one advantage of the Common Core. It sets out a schedule for education that would be followed in all states. If you're learning fractions in Texas in fourth grade, they're learning them in New York that year, too. This is extremely valuable for people who move -- for example, the children of our military personnel, who often get reassigned to new states every two or three years. That was my experience growing up. What happens when schedules are set haphazardly by state is that students in my situation will cover the same material two or three times as they move around, growing extremely bored, while other material they'll miss entirely, leaving them at a loss when the material is needed for later study. I might get long division three times but never learn complex fractions, or get three units on the Civil War, but never one about the Revolutionary War. State control of such matters is absurdly inefficient in an increasingly national economy and society.

You mean parents may have to actually participate and take ownership in the rearing and education of their children rather than state-exclusivity? Why I cannot begin to conceive of parental primacy, ownership, and stewardship in making up any such deltas... :-/

(I've moved my family several times. All three children have been/are high honor roll students in every location - currently New York).

I'm not arguing against Common Core. I am rejecting the constant presentation of all issues not imposed via government solution as some sort of vacuum. There is more than the state. Much, much more.
 
What you describe happens in just transferring from one School District to another in the same area.

One District has higher standards and curriculum from another . Very hard on students that transfer from poor Districts in catching up.
 
You mean parents may have to actually participate and take ownership in the rearing and education of their children rather than state-exclusivity? Why I cannot begin to conceive of parental primacy, ownership, and stewardship in making up any such deltas... :-/

(I've moved my family several times. All three children have been/are high honor roll students in every location - currently New York).

I'm not arguing against Common Core. I am rejecting the constant presentation of all issues not imposed via government solution as some sort of vacuum. There is more than the state. Much, much more.
Of course there's more than the state. That's glaringly obvious. But, with some things, people can coordinate their efforts, for their mutual benefit, through the state. Common Core principles, to align curricula across states, is a great example. Yes, you are welcome to do without the government entirely, if you want. Go off and live in a cabin somewhere and educate your kids at home. But for those of us using public schools, it's helpful to have a common core curriculum that allows our tax money to be used more efficiently and effectively, including minimizing the amount of time our kids spend covering redundant material or struggling to make up for missed material when they move.
 
Of course there's more than the state. That's glaringly obvious. But, with some things, people can coordinate their efforts, for their mutual benefit, through the state. Common Core principles, to align curricula across states, is a great example. Yes, you are welcome to do without the government entirely, if you want. Go off and live in a cabin somewhere and educate your kids at home. But for those of us using public schools, it's helpful to have a common core curriculum that allows our tax money to be used more efficiently and effectively, including minimizing the amount of time our kids spend covering redundant material or struggling to make up for missed material when they move.

Yes. It is useful for you to dictate what must be - and we must centralize and central plan. More!
 
Yes. It is useful for you to dictate what must be - and we must centralize and central plan. More!

I'm not always in favor of more centralization and consistency. I just spent last week debating, at length, the issue of whether certain breast-cancer-awareness bracelets were appropriate for kids to be wearing in school. I would have left it for the parents to decide -- each for his own kids. I'd say the same about school uniforms, drug testing, and countless other school-related issues. But when it comes to setting up curricula, doing it in a disorganized state-by-state, or even district-by-district manner is needlessly confusing, expensive, and inefficient.
 
where in the constitution does it say that the federal government has the right to mandated specific course content for local schools across the nation?

local parent involvement in schools is vital to their success . people won't vote for tax increases to support schools they have no control over, and will flee to private schools.

can you think of ANY time in the past when the federal government could have "federalized" public education nationwide, and you would have applauded the results? the nixon era? eisenower? carter?
 
There's a recent push by right-wingers to resist the Common Core standards for education. This is enough to give a person political whiplash, since for decades the conservatives were the ones out front pushing for defined standards in education. But the Common Core, despite the work predating Obama and not being run by the federal government, has become associated with Obama by his support for it, and so now lots of Republicans are against it. Just as Obama's support for the Romneycare/Heritage Foundation conservative healthcare reform made that poisonous for those whose political principles are defined in opposition to whatever Obama supports, now a conservative's dream education reform is in danger of becoming something the GOP unites against.

I just want to take a moment to talk up one advantage of the Common Core. It sets out a schedule for education that would be followed in all states. If you're learning fractions in Texas in fourth grade, they're learning them in New York that year, too. This is extremely valuable for people who move -- for example, the children of our military personnel, who often get reassigned to new states every two or three years. That was my experience growing up. What happens when schedules are set haphazardly by state is that students in my situation will cover the same material two or three times as they move around, growing extremely bored, while other material they'll miss entirely, leaving them at a loss when the material is needed for later study. I might get long division three times but never learn complex fractions, or get three units on the Civil War, but never one about the Revolutionary War. State control of such matters is absurdly inefficient in an increasingly national economy and society.


My son is in first grade and for the last year and this year they are really pushing the move to common core. The reality though is - as it will be applied in our school system, will actually be lowering our standards. It has become a very loud and vocal battle in a county which has one of the best school systems in a State which has one of the best school systems in the Country.

It is - in effect - educating to the lowest common denominator. Yes, moving from school system to school system may have been a problem for some kids. But, most parents try to as much as possible eliminate moving during the school year, or even changing school districts if at all possible once their kids are in school. So, there is no reason for changing an entire country's programs simply to accommodate what is a minority of the students.

My kids are in an excellent school system - one I pay a heck of a lot of money in property taxes for, and one I chose to live in - despite the fact it makes it an hour commute each way for me to go to work. Now, in effect, you are lowering my standards so school systems like Baltimore City - can keep up.

I am not in favor of national educational standards. We are a diverse country with a diverse populace, and whose people have differing needs, backgrounds and abilities. What localized education has offered - is the chance for various localities to tailor their education to the people, the resources and quite frankly the interest in education of the society they serve. I am very interested in my child's education. I take days off of work to volunteer. I attend the school improvement committee meetings, the curriculum meetings, the book choosing meetings. Why - because I care and I am committed and I want our school district to be the absolute best and give our kids the absolute best education we can. What Baltimore City does or how they do it, quite frankly is not my problem. Because they have proven time and again to suck resources and produce few results - why - because the surrounding community lacks an interest and an commitment to education. And, what Common Core does then - is force my community - to lower its standards. And, admittedly it may force a few to raise theirs. But again - to my community and my children loss.

We actually saw - statewide a fall in standardized test scores ( which admittedly I am no fan of for judging education but it is what we have) which has been attributed to phasing in the common core and now the common core doesn't align with what the kids are tested on. So essentially - what we once deemed critical for kids to know - is not critical under common core... again - just more proof that it is nothing more than a lowering of standards when you come from an already very good school system.

And, in fact the Baltimore Sun ran an article this weekend about how while more minority students are being encouraged to take AP classes - they actually don't ultimately pass the tests on par with their non- minority peers even though they pass the classes with A's and B's. Which in the end really turned out to be not about specific minority students but about the school systems in the State which have a large minority student population.

And, ultimately the people who write and administer the AP exams and many educators have weighed in and say - what this amounts to - is effectively giving these students a false sense of accomplishment. They think that they know this material because they are taking courses ( frequently graded on a curve) and they do well in them..... but in the end... they don't actually have a mastery of the material. And, that is what common core - like its predecessor in federal education reform NCLB - are all about. Making the kids feel like they are successful through advancing them through coursework and redesigning the coursework to accommodate their abilities. But, in the end... they will lack a mastery of the material.

And, meanwhile classes that have kids who could do more and are better students because they are better prepared at home ... will ultimately be held back in many ways by a system that can't be tailored up to their abilities. If my kids could make it three more chapters than others because as a whole the parents are focused on homework and send their kids to school well prepared to meet the challenges of the school day.... then they are prohibited from doing that as a class - because they would no longer be teaching exactly what everyone else is learning. It is my understanding that actual GT and learning support programs would be in place, but it is the kids who are "average" for their area but who are maybe above "average" for the nation - who will be loosing out.

Yep... great... great... idea.

connie
 
There's a recent push by right-wingers to resist the Common Core standards for education. This is enough to give a person political whiplash, since for decades the conservatives were the ones out front pushing for defined standards in education. But the Common Core, despite the work predating Obama and not being run by the federal government, has become associated with Obama by his support for it, and so now lots of Republicans are against it. Just as Obama's support for the Romneycare/Heritage Foundation conservative healthcare reform made that poisonous for those whose political principles are defined in opposition to whatever Obama supports, now a conservative's dream education reform is in danger of becoming something the GOP unites against.

I just want to take a moment to talk up one advantage of the Common Core. It sets out a schedule for education that would be followed in all states. If you're learning fractions in Texas in fourth grade, they're learning them in New York that year, too. This is extremely valuable for people who move -- for example, the children of our military personnel, who often get reassigned to new states every two or three years. That was my experience growing up. What happens when schedules are set haphazardly by state is that students in my situation will cover the same material two or three times as they move around, growing extremely bored, while other material they'll miss entirely, leaving them at a loss when the material is needed for later study. I might get long division three times but never learn complex fractions, or get three units on the Civil War, but never one about the Revolutionary War. State control of such matters is absurdly inefficient in an increasingly national economy and society.

Both of my kids went to private schools. The public schools are sewers.

They can teach what they wish.
 
Both of my kids went to private schools. The public schools are sewers.

They can teach what they wish.
I went to public school and was happy with my education. My brother mostly went to public schools, too, and he turned out well. Those schools can be made better, though, which is the point of the Common Core rules.
 
where in the constitution does it say that the federal government has the right to mandated specific course content for local schools across the nation?

local parent involvement in schools is vital to their success . people won't vote for tax increases to support schools they have no control over, and will flee to private schools.

can you think of ANY time in the past when the federal government could have "federalized" public education nationwide, and you would have applauded the results? the nixon era? eisenower? carter?
The Common Core is not, currently, about the federal government mandating anything. The government is simply using funds to incentivize states to participate. I would, however, be quite comfortable with the government simply dictating it, on the basis of its ability to regulate Congress, on the theory that the education of the workforce is a clear commerce issue.
 
I went to public school and was happy with my education. My brother mostly went to public schools, too, and he turned out well. Those schools can be made better, though, which is the point of the Common Core rules.

I went to public schools as well. In the 70's. They were much better then.

My grandson starts school next year...he'll never see a day of public schools.
 
My son is in first grade and for the last year and this year they are really pushing the move to common core. The reality though is - as it will be applied in our school system, will actually be lowering our standards. It has become a very loud and vocal battle in a county which has one of the best school systems in a State which has one of the best school systems in the Country.

It is - in effect - educating to the lowest common denominator. Yes, moving from school system to school system may have been a problem for some kids. But, most parents try to as much as possible eliminate moving during the school year, or even changing school districts if at all possible once their kids are in school. So, there is no reason for changing an entire country's programs simply to accommodate what is a minority of the students.

My kids are in an excellent school system - one I pay a heck of a lot of money in property taxes for, and one I chose to live in - despite the fact it makes it an hour commute each way for me to go to work. Now, in effect, you are lowering my standards so school systems like Baltimore City - can keep up.

I am not in favor of national educational standards. We are a diverse country with a diverse populace, and whose people have differing needs, backgrounds and abilities. What localized education has offered - is the chance for various localities to tailor their education to the people, the resources and quite frankly the interest in education of the society they serve. I am very interested in my child's education. I take days off of work to volunteer. I attend the school improvement committee meetings, the curriculum meetings, the book choosing meetings. Why - because I care and I am committed and I want our school district to be the absolute best and give our kids the absolute best education we can. What Baltimore City does or how they do it, quite frankly is not my problem. Because they have proven time and again to suck resources and produce few results - why - because the surrounding community lacks an interest and an commitment to education. And, what Common Core does then - is force my community - to lower its standards. And, admittedly it may force a few to raise theirs. But again - to my community and my children loss.

We actually saw - statewide a fall in standardized test scores ( which admittedly I am no fan of for judging education but it is what we have) which has been attributed to phasing in the common core and now the common core doesn't align with what the kids are tested on. So essentially - what we once deemed critical for kids to know - is not critical under common core... again - just more proof that it is nothing more than a lowering of standards when you come from an already very good school system.

And, in fact the Baltimore Sun ran an article this weekend about how while more minority students are being encouraged to take AP classes - they actually don't ultimately pass the tests on par with their non- minority peers even though they pass the classes with A's and B's. Which in the end really turned out to be not about specific minority students but about the school systems in the State which have a large minority student population.

And, ultimately the people who write and administer the AP exams and many educators have weighed in and say - what this amounts to - is effectively giving these students a false sense of accomplishment. They think that they know this material because they are taking courses ( frequently graded on a curve) and they do well in them..... but in the end... they don't actually have a mastery of the material. And, that is what common core - like its predecessor in federal education reform NCLB - are all about. Making the kids feel like they are successful through advancing them through coursework and redesigning the coursework to accommodate their abilities. But, in the end... they will lack a mastery of the material.

And, meanwhile classes that have kids who could do more and are better students because they are better prepared at home ... will ultimately be held back in many ways by a system that can't be tailored up to their abilities. If my kids could make it three more chapters than others because as a whole the parents are focused on homework and send their kids to school well prepared to meet the challenges of the school day.... then they are prohibited from doing that as a class - because they would no longer be teaching exactly what everyone else is learning. It is my understanding that actual GT and learning support programs would be in place, but it is the kids who are "average" for their area but who are maybe above "average" for the nation - who will be loosing out.

Yep... great... great... idea.

connie
The common core sets a floor, not a ceiling. Any district is free to require more.
 
Paranoid conspiracy theorism about "Common Core" is the best way to spot a talk radio fan....especially of the more wacko kind like Glenn Beck, Levin, or the Savage Weiner.
 
The common core sets a floor, not a ceiling. Any district is free to require more.

Except once you set that "standard" that is what it becomes... everyone just gravitates towards that. So, in essence it will cause the lowering of the bar.

connie
 
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