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Flat Tax Math

Arkady

President
Rand Paul is advocating moving to a single flat tax, as opposed to a graduated income tax. He is also advocating a move that would make it so those who live off unearned investment income get a free ride at the expense of those of us who do productive labor.

It's worth taking a look at the math behind this, and what it would mean to most people. Currently the average effective federal tax rate is around 17.6%.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=456

Therefore, in order to be revenue neutral, a new tax system would also have to have an average effective federal tax rate of around 17.6% (probably around a 25% nominal flat tax, with minimal exemptions and some allowance for tax dodging and other collections issues). So, if it was flat, here's what would happen to the effective tax rate of each of the following income percentiles:

0-20th: +15.7
21-40th: +10.6
41-60th: +6.4
61-80th: +2.4
81-90th: -1.0
91-95th: -3.5
96-99th: -6.7
Top 1%: -11.4

If you're lower class, it's a crippling tax hike, which would either force a radical expansion of social spending or would result in mass starvation and homelessness. If you're middle class, it's still a big tax hike. For those right in the middle, they'll be handing Uncle Sam $1.57, under the new system, for every $1 they currently hand him. Even the upper-middle class will be getting hosed.

If you're lower-upper-class, it's a small tax cut, while for those in the upper reaches, it becomes a more significant cut. And for the very richest, it's a gigantic cut. In fact, those numbers don't do justice to just how much a tax scheme like Paul's would favor the wealthy, since he couples it with an elimination of taxes on investment income, the lion's share of which is "earned" by the rich.

If you're cutting out the $100 billion or so of capital gains tax revenues, plus around $20 billion in estate and gift taxes (another sweetheart deal from Paul to the wealthy), and who knows how much more in interest and dividends taxes, and you want revenue neutrality, you're going to need to hike taxes on the working classes even more than the figures above indicate. You wind up with an effective income tax hike on over 90% of Americans.

For the ultra-rich, the Paul tax cut would be truly epic. Take Mitt Romney, for example. Using the numbers he filed in 2012, when he earned $13.7 million, only $200,000 of which was for actual labor (the rest being investment income), Romney would pay an effective tax rate of less than 0.3% -- down from an already shockingly low 14.1%. So, for him it would be a reduction of 13.8 points, and he'd pay less, not just as a rate but even in dollar terms, than millions of hard-working professionals who earn a fraction what he does. For Romney, it means approximately $1.9 million more in his pocket per year. I'm sure that'll help finance the next dancing horse or car elevator.

It's not hard to get why super-rich people love the idea of a flat tax. It's just not clear why anyone else does.

Just to clarify, Rand Paul doesn't propose a 17.6% rate. His proposal is 17%, and he allows for various exemptions. However, if you're starting out below the current 17.6% effective rate, just for the nominal rate, and allowing exemptions, then the effective rate will wind up far below the current effective rate, meaning a massive revenue shortfall and a gigantic increase in deficits. My math is for a revenue-neutral tax cut, not one that would drive the country into financial ruin like Paul's. Paul's own campaign admits his plan would cut revenues by $700 billion per year. So, it's a fairy-tale tax scheme based on the idea that we can radically slash federal spending even as we hike the tax bill for the vast majority of Americans, all to make the wealthy few even richer.

And as horribly as this scheme would work right from the start, it would get even worse with time. Given the free ride for investment income, employers would soon realize that they can hire people cheaper if they make their incomes tax-free by disguising it as investment income rather than salaries and wages. We already see some of that today, with senior execs and hedge fund managers getting a big part of their pay disguised in those ways to take advantage of lower taxes on investment income, but there's little incentive to do that for those who aren't very rich today, since their income tax rates aren't appreciably higher (and are sometimes lower) than rates on investment income. But if you have a 0% rate on investment income, the incentive will be there to structure everyone's compensation in such a way as to characterize as much as possible as investment income. For example, give all employees special "preferred stock" that pays most of their incomes as "dividends," and leave them with only a minimum-wage income taxable at income tax rates. And that will further crater revenues, requiring still higher tax rates on those still paying income taxes. It's a death spiral that anyone could see coming.
 
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Rand Paul is advocating moving to a single flat tax, as opposed to a graduated income tax. He is also advocating a move that would make it so those who live off unearned investment income get a free ride at the expense of those of us who do productive labor.

It's worth taking a look at the math behind this, and what it would mean to most people. Currently the average effective federal tax rate is around 17.6%.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=456

Therefore, in order to be revenue neutral, a new tax system would also have to have an average effective federal tax rate of around 17.6% (probably around a 25% nominal flat tax, with minimal exemptions and some allowance for tax dodging and other collections issues). So, if it was flat, here's what would happen to the effective tax rate of each of the following income percentiles:

0-20th: +15.7
21-40th: +10.6
41-60th: +6.4
61-80th: +2.4
81-90th: -1.0
91-95th: -3.5
96-99th: -6.7
Top 1%: -11.4

If you're lower class, it's a crippling tax hike, which would either force a radical expansion of social spending or would result in mass starvation and homelessness. If you're middle class, it's still a big tax hike. For those right in the middle, they'll be handing Uncle Sam $1.57, under the new system, for every $1 they currently hand him. Even the upper-middle class will be getting hosed.

If you're lower-upper-class, it's a small tax cut, while for those in the upper reaches, it becomes a more significant cut. And for the very richest, it's a gigantic cut. In fact, those numbers don't do justice to just how much a tax scheme like Paul's would favor the wealthy, since he couples it with an elimination of taxes on investment income, the lion's share of which is "earned" by the rich.

If you're cutting out the $100 billion or so of capital gains tax revenues, plus around $20 billion in estate and gift taxes (another sweetheart deal from Paul to the wealthy), and who knows how much more in interest and dividends taxes, and you want revenue neutrality, you're going to need to hike taxes on the working classes even more than the figures above indicate. You wind up with an effective income tax hike on over 90% of Americans.

For the ultra-rich, the Paul tax cut would be truly epic. Take Mitt Romney, for example. Using the numbers he filed in 2012, when he earned $13.7 million, only $200,000 of which was for actual labor (the rest being investment income), Romney would pay an effective tax rate of less than 0.3% -- down from an already shockingly low 14.1%. So, for him it would be a reduction of 13.8 points, and he'd pay less, not just as a rate but even in dollar terms, than millions of hard-working professionals who earn a fraction what he does. For Romney, it means approximately $1.9 million more in his pocket per year. I'm sure that'll help finance the next dancing horse or car elevator.

It's not hard to get why super-rich people love the idea of a flat tax. It's just not clear why anyone else does.

Just to clarify, Rand Paul doesn't propose a 17.6% rate. His proposal is 17%, and he allows for various exemptions. However, if you're starting out below the current 17.6% effective rate, just for the nominal rate, and allowing exemptions, then the effective rate will wind up far below the current effective rate, meaning a massive revenue shortfall and a gigantic increase in deficits. My math is for a revenue-neutral tax cut, not one that would drive the country into financial ruin like Paul's. Paul's own campaign admits his plan would cut revenues by $700 billion per year. So, it's a fairy-tale tax scheme based on the idea that we can radically slash federal spending even as we hike the tax bill for the vast majority of Americans, all to make the wealthy few even richer.

And as horribly as this scheme would work right from the start, it would get even worse with time. Given the free ride for investment income, employers would soon realize that they can hire people cheaper if they make their incomes tax-free by disguising it as investment income rather than salaries and wages. We already see some of that today, with senior execs and hedge fund managers getting a big part of their pay disguised in those ways to take advantage of lower taxes on investment income, but there's little incentive to do that for those who aren't very rich today, since their income tax rates aren't appreciably higher (and are sometimes lower) than rates on investment income. But if you have a 0% rate on investment income, the incentive will be there to structure everyone's compensation in such a way as to characterize as much as possible as investment income. For example, give all employees special "preferred stock" that pays most of their incomes as "dividends," and leave them with only a minimum-wage income taxable at income tax rates. And that will further crater revenues, requiring still higher tax rates on those still paying income taxes. It's a death spiral that anyone could see coming.
I very much encourage people here to try the math themselves. Come up with a proposed tax scheme, plug it into an Excel spreadsheet using the Census's data on income distribution by household, and you can figure out easily enough what level of revenue it'll produce. If you make an honest effort to play around with that, you'll soon realize that a flatter tax system must necessarily mean a crushing increase of taxes on the majority, a gigantic deficit, or the necessity for huge spending cuts.... or some combination of the three.

Flatter taxes can be made to work, even in modern nations, but everywhere they've succeeded on a large scale they're coupled with much more generous social spending and much less military spending. Essentially, you wind up with much higher taxes on the poor and middle class, but then that burden is offset by the government financing much more of their lifestyles (e.g., free healthcare, free university, highly subsidized public transit and childcare, etc.), so that their expendable income remains similar. Much of Western Europe has a tax structure like that, with most revenues coming through a fairly flat AMT. But, as I suggested, they have a generous welfare state. I'm not clear on how you'd make a flatter tax work in a modern nation without that expansion of social spending, and shrinkage of the military budget, since the hardship you'd create for the majority seems certain to create dangerous social instability. How do you hit the middle and lower classes with a huge hike to their tax bill without doing anything more to help them make ends meet, and not expect that to trigger serious problems in the society?
 
Essentially, you wind up with much higher taxes on the poor and middle class, but then that burden is offset by the government financing much more of their lifestyles (e.g., free healthcare, free university, highly subsidized public transit and childcare, etc.), so that their expendable income remains similar.

It's adorable how you still refer to that as "free".

clueless.jpg
 
its only a "crippling tax hike" for the poor if someone sets the minimum income level very low.

what is the proposed minimum income that the tax hits?

the founding fathers apparently believed that almost everyone - rich and poor - should have some skin in the game, and pay something to the upkeep of their nation in exchange for its benefits.

they likely would be horrified at the present situation with so many people not paying tax, except for social security which is in danger of insolvency anwyay
 
It's adorable how you still refer to that as "free".
Read it in context, shitwit. In the very same sentence, I refer to it being financed by government. The point is that it is free from the perspective of the recipient, not that it is without cost to anyone.
 
Read it in context, shitwit. In the very same sentence, I refer to it being financed by government. The point is that it is free from the perspective of the recipient, not that it is without cost to anyone.

"Financed by government"? LOL, you really are an idiot.

This reminds me of the time you insisted Christians believe that the priest giving communion is the one performing the transubstantiation. Hilarious what gullible people will believe...
 
its only a "crippling tax hike" for the poor if someone sets the minimum income level very low.

what is the proposed minimum income that the tax hits?

He has been shifty about the details, and has now struck the plan from his website, so I'm not sure anyone can say what he has in mind. Probably even he doesn't know. But you can come at the problem easily enough from the other direction. See here:

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=456

Since he's calling for a 17% flat tax, the absolute MAXIMUM the tax could be for anyone would be 17% (if there were no dodges, no exemptions, no cheating, etc.) Yet, right now, the 81st-90th percentile pays 18.6% effective rate, the 91st-95th pays 21.1%, the 96th-99th pays 24.3%, and the top 1% pays 29.0%. They're all getting big tax cuts. But there's no such thing as a free lunch. All those dollars you're no longer collecting there have consequences. They're going to show up in one or more of the following ways:

(1) Higher taxes for the bottom 80% of taxpayers.
(2) Savage cuts to the programs that are disproportionately relied on by the poor and middle class.
(3) Big deficit increases.... which, in the long run, are going to mean much higher taxes for somebody.

The math dictates the result. You can't lower the tax burden on the rich in a way that cuts revenues from them by the better part of a trillion dollars without a counter-balancing budget impact elsewhere.

the founding fathers.... would be horrified at the present situation

Lots of them would be horrified by the fact black people are allowed to wander our streets freely rather than being used as slave labor on large plantations. The Founders aren't a great source for moral clarity or practical economics.
 
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"Financed by government"? LOL, you really are an idiot.

This reminds me of the time you insisted Christians believe that the priest giving communion is the one performing the transubstantiation. Hilarious what gullible people will believe...
I remember well the time that you tried to analogize the priest's role in the transubstantiation to the weatherman's role in the creation of weather. We all had a good laugh at your stupidity. Ah, good times.
 
I remember well the time that you tried to analogize the priest's role in the transubstantiation to the weatherman's role in the creation of weather. We all had a good laugh at your stupidity. Ah, good times.

Actually, I was responding to your idiotic suggestion that the priest is the one who performs the miracle. No doubt you also believe the weatherman makes it rain (though you adorably denied it). Believe me, we ALL had a good laugh at your dumb, bigoted display of foolishness...good times indeed.
 
Actually, I was responding to your idiotic suggestion that the priest is the one who performs the miracle. No doubt you also believe the weatherman makes it rain (though you adorably denied it). Believe me, we ALL had a good laugh at your dumb, bigoted display of foolishness...good times indeed.
That's the great thing about this forum. Your idiocy is preserved forever..... anyone can go into the archive and have a good laugh at your expense, and no matter how you try to spin it now, it's still there.
 
Rand Paul is advocating moving to a single flat tax, as opposed to a graduated income tax. He is also advocating a move that would make it so those who live off unearned investment income get a free ride at the expense of those of us who do productive labor.

It's worth taking a look at the math behind this, and what it would mean to most people. Currently the average effective federal tax rate is around 17.6%.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=456

Therefore, in order to be revenue neutral, a new tax system would also have to have an average effective federal tax rate of around 17.6% (probably around a 25% nominal flat tax, with minimal exemptions and some allowance for tax dodging and other collections issues). So, if it was flat, here's what would happen to the effective tax rate of each of the following income percentiles:

0-20th: +15.7
21-40th: +10.6
41-60th: +6.4
61-80th: +2.4
81-90th: -1.0
91-95th: -3.5
96-99th: -6.7
Top 1%: -11.4

If you're lower class, it's a crippling tax hike, which would either force a radical expansion of social spending or would result in mass starvation and homelessness. If you're middle class, it's still a big tax hike. For those right in the middle, they'll be handing Uncle Sam $1.57, under the new system, for every $1 they currently hand him. Even the upper-middle class will be getting hosed.

If you're lower-upper-class, it's a small tax cut, while for those in the upper reaches, it becomes a more significant cut. And for the very richest, it's a gigantic cut. In fact, those numbers don't do justice to just how much a tax scheme like Paul's would favor the wealthy, since he couples it with an elimination of taxes on investment income, the lion's share of which is "earned" by the rich.

If you're cutting out the $100 billion or so of capital gains tax revenues, plus around $20 billion in estate and gift taxes (another sweetheart deal from Paul to the wealthy), and who knows how much more in interest and dividends taxes, and you want revenue neutrality, you're going to need to hike taxes on the working classes even more than the figures above indicate. You wind up with an effective income tax hike on over 90% of Americans.

For the ultra-rich, the Paul tax cut would be truly epic. Take Mitt Romney, for example. Using the numbers he filed in 2012, when he earned $13.7 million, only $200,000 of which was for actual labor (the rest being investment income), Romney would pay an effective tax rate of less than 0.3% -- down from an already shockingly low 14.1%. So, for him it would be a reduction of 13.8 points, and he'd pay less, not just as a rate but even in dollar terms, than millions of hard-working professionals who earn a fraction what he does. For Romney, it means approximately $1.9 million more in his pocket per year. I'm sure that'll help finance the next dancing horse or car elevator.

It's not hard to get why super-rich people love the idea of a flat tax. It's just not clear why anyone else does.

Just to clarify, Rand Paul doesn't propose a 17.6% rate. His proposal is 17%, and he allows for various exemptions. However, if you're starting out below the current 17.6% effective rate, just for the nominal rate, and allowing exemptions, then the effective rate will wind up far below the current effective rate, meaning a massive revenue shortfall and a gigantic increase in deficits. My math is for a revenue-neutral tax cut, not one that would drive the country into financial ruin like Paul's. Paul's own campaign admits his plan would cut revenues by $700 billion per year. So, it's a fairy-tale tax scheme based on the idea that we can radically slash federal spending even as we hike the tax bill for the vast majority of Americans, all to make the wealthy few even richer.

And as horribly as this scheme would work right from the start, it would get even worse with time. Given the free ride for investment income, employers would soon realize that they can hire people cheaper if they make their incomes tax-free by disguising it as investment income rather than salaries and wages. We already see some of that today, with senior execs and hedge fund managers getting a big part of their pay disguised in those ways to take advantage of lower taxes on investment income, but there's little incentive to do that for those who aren't very rich today, since their income tax rates aren't appreciably higher (and are sometimes lower) than rates on investment income. But if you have a 0% rate on investment income, the incentive will be there to structure everyone's compensation in such a way as to characterize as much as possible as investment income. For example, give all employees special "preferred stock" that pays most of their incomes as "dividends," and leave them with only a minimum-wage income taxable at income tax rates. And that will further crater revenues, requiring still higher tax rates on those still paying income taxes. It's a death spiral that anyone could see coming.

Rand Paul released tax rates on each percentile group?
 
I very much encourage people here to try the math themselves. Come up with a proposed tax scheme, plug it into an Excel spreadsheet using the Census's data on income distribution by household, and you can figure out easily enough what level of revenue it'll produce. If you make an honest effort to play around with that, you'll soon realize that a flatter tax system must necessarily mean a crushing increase of taxes on the majority, a gigantic deficit, or the necessity for huge spending cuts.... or some combination of the three.

Flatter taxes can be made to work, even in modern nations, but everywhere they've succeeded on a large scale they're coupled with much more generous social spending and much less military spending. Essentially, you wind up with much higher taxes on the poor and middle class, but then that burden is offset by the government financing much more of their lifestyles (e.g., free healthcare, free university, highly subsidized public transit and childcare, etc.), so that their expendable income remains similar. Much of Western Europe has a tax structure like that, with most revenues coming through a fairly flat AMT. But, as I suggested, they have a generous welfare state. I'm not clear on how you'd make a flatter tax work in a modern nation without that expansion of social spending, and shrinkage of the military budget, since the hardship you'd create for the majority seems certain to create dangerous social instability. How do you hit the middle and lower classes with a huge hike to their tax bill without doing anything more to help them make ends meet, and not expect that to trigger serious problems in the society?

The US economy is much bigger than other nations, tough to compare.
 
Rand Paul released tax rates on each percentile group?
No. He released the tax rate. I'm comparing that rate to the effective rate paid by each percentile group today. Since the comparison makes it unavoidable that the Paul plan would be a gigantic tax cut for the wealthiest Americans, those missing revenues have to show up elsewhere.
 
Rand Paul is advocating moving to a single flat tax, as opposed to a graduated income tax. He is also advocating a move that would make it so those who live off unearned investment income get a free ride at the expense of those of us who do productive labor.

It's worth taking a look at the math behind this, and what it would mean to most people. Currently the average effective federal tax rate is around 17.6%.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=456

Therefore, in order to be revenue neutral, a new tax system would also have to have an average effective federal tax rate of around 17.6% (probably around a 25% nominal flat tax, with minimal exemptions and some allowance for tax dodging and other collections issues). So, if it was flat, here's what would happen to the effective tax rate of each of the following income percentiles:

0-20th: +15.7
21-40th: +10.6
41-60th: +6.4
61-80th: +2.4
81-90th: -1.0
91-95th: -3.5
96-99th: -6.7
Top 1%: -11.4

If you're lower class, it's a crippling tax hike, which would either force a radical expansion of social spending or would result in mass starvation and homelessness. If you're middle class, it's still a big tax hike. For those right in the middle, they'll be handing Uncle Sam $1.57, under the new system, for every $1 they currently hand him. Even the upper-middle class will be getting hosed.

If you're lower-upper-class, it's a small tax cut, while for those in the upper reaches, it becomes a more significant cut. And for the very richest, it's a gigantic cut. In fact, those numbers don't do justice to just how much a tax scheme like Paul's would favor the wealthy, since he couples it with an elimination of taxes on investment income, the lion's share of which is "earned" by the rich.

If you're cutting out the $100 billion or so of capital gains tax revenues, plus around $20 billion in estate and gift taxes (another sweetheart deal from Paul to the wealthy), and who knows how much more in interest and dividends taxes, and you want revenue neutrality, you're going to need to hike taxes on the working classes even more than the figures above indicate. You wind up with an effective income tax hike on over 90% of Americans.

For the ultra-rich, the Paul tax cut would be truly epic. Take Mitt Romney, for example. Using the numbers he filed in 2012, when he earned $13.7 million, only $200,000 of which was for actual labor (the rest being investment income), Romney would pay an effective tax rate of less than 0.3% -- down from an already shockingly low 14.1%. So, for him it would be a reduction of 13.8 points, and he'd pay less, not just as a rate but even in dollar terms, than millions of hard-working professionals who earn a fraction what he does. For Romney, it means approximately $1.9 million more in his pocket per year. I'm sure that'll help finance the next dancing horse or car elevator.

It's not hard to get why super-rich people love the idea of a flat tax. It's just not clear why anyone else does.

Just to clarify, Rand Paul doesn't propose a 17.6% rate. His proposal is 17%, and he allows for various exemptions. However, if you're starting out below the current 17.6% effective rate, just for the nominal rate, and allowing exemptions, then the effective rate will wind up far below the current effective rate, meaning a massive revenue shortfall and a gigantic increase in deficits. My math is for a revenue-neutral tax cut, not one that would drive the country into financial ruin like Paul's. Paul's own campaign admits his plan would cut revenues by $700 billion per year. So, it's a fairy-tale tax scheme based on the idea that we can radically slash federal spending even as we hike the tax bill for the vast majority of Americans, all to make the wealthy few even richer.

And as horribly as this scheme would work right from the start, it would get even worse with time. Given the free ride for investment income, employers would soon realize that they can hire people cheaper if they make their incomes tax-free by disguising it as investment income rather than salaries and wages. We already see some of that today, with senior execs and hedge fund managers getting a big part of their pay disguised in those ways to take advantage of lower taxes on investment income, but there's little incentive to do that for those who aren't very rich today, since their income tax rates aren't appreciably higher (and are sometimes lower) than rates on investment income. But if you have a 0% rate on investment income, the incentive will be there to structure everyone's compensation in such a way as to characterize as much as possible as investment income. For example, give all employees special "preferred stock" that pays most of their incomes as "dividends," and leave them with only a minimum-wage income taxable at income tax rates. And that will further crater revenues, requiring still higher tax rates on those still paying income taxes. It's a death spiral that anyone could see coming.

Of all the flim-flams the GOP propagandists have foisted off on their rabble, the "flat tax" may be the most egregious. By definition, a truly flat tax would drastically slash taxes on the wealthy, and raise taxes on the rabble, but the rabble still support it.

Amazing.
 
The US economy is much bigger than other nations, tough to compare.
In theory, that should give us an advantage that smaller economies don't have. If you ever read the press of small nations, they're acutely aware of the challenges that come with having no decent economies of scale. It's analogous to the way that small companies in the US often point out that they can't provide benefits to their employees that are competitive to what big companies can provide, because the economics don't work out for them. For example, if you're GE and you're trying to get health insurance for your employees, you can get a group rate that's a lot better than some mom-and-pop company can get, so at any given price level, you can provide your employees much better health care.

http://www.allbusiness.com/standard...nt-packages-for-emerging-companies-753-1.html

The US has the world's biggest economy, and so should be able to get unit prices that are better than what anyone else can afford, when it comes to government services. The market size should give us better bargaining power in the market (e.g., to negotiate lower drug costs), and the economies of scale should make it possible to have lower per capita administrative expenses, leaving us with more money to provide actual benefits rather than just administering programs. Unfortunately, with states-rights concerns having fractured our market, and anti-government zealotry interfering with our ability to use our market power (e.g., Bush made is so Medicare can't legally negotiate drug prices with pharmaceutical companies), it seldom works out that way in practice. But that's DESPITE the gigantic natural advantages of our bigger economy. We should be able to out-compete the little countries in the same way big corporations out-compete the mom-and-pop companies.
 
Of all the flim-flams the GOP propagandists have foisted off on their rabble, the "flat tax" may be the most egregious. By definition, a truly flat tax would drastically slash taxes on the wealthy, and raise taxes on the rabble, but the rabble still support it.

Amazing.
Most people just suck at math. It's not even hard math, but they're too lazy or stupid to crunch the numbers, so they just fall for the rhetoric instead.
 
Most people just suck at math. It's not even hard math, but they're too lazy or stupid to crunch the numbers, so they just fall for the rhetoric instead.

The propagandists try to appeal to the rabble by telling them they could "send in their tax return on a postcard." Maybe, but the postcard would show a much bigger tax payment.

;-)
 
In theory, that should give us an advantage that smaller economies don't have. If you ever read the press of small nations, they're acutely aware of the challenges that come with having no decent economies of scale. It's analogous to the way that small companies in the US often point out that they can't provide benefits to their employees that are competitive to what big companies can provide, because the economics don't work out for them. For example, if you're GE and you're trying to get health insurance for your employees, you can get a group rate that's a lot better than some mom-and-pop company can get, so at any given price level, you can provide your employees much better health care.

http://www.allbusiness.com/standard...nt-packages-for-emerging-companies-753-1.html

The US has the world's biggest economy, and so should be able to get unit prices that are better than what anyone else can afford, when it comes to government services. The market size should give us better bargaining power in the market (e.g., to negotiate lower drug costs), and the economies of scale should make it possible to have lower per capita administrative expenses, leaving us with more money to provide actual benefits rather than just administering programs. Unfortunately, with states-rights concerns having fractured our market, and anti-government zealotry interfering with our ability to use our market power (e.g., Bush made is so Medicare can't legally negotiate drug prices with pharmaceutical companies), it seldom works out that way in practice. But that's DESPITE the gigantic natural advantages of our bigger economy. We should be able to out-compete the little countries in the same way big corporations out-compete the mom-and-pop companies.

And that is one of the problems. Government workers are not efficient and is not run like a company
 
No. He released the tax rate. I'm comparing that rate to the effective rate paid by each percentile group today. Since the comparison makes it unavoidable that the Paul plan would be a gigantic tax cut for the wealthiest Americans, those missing revenues have to show up elsewhere.

Right now there is a lot of equality and fairness talk and subjects going around in the usa.

Flat tax fits into that conversation. Each person paying equally for the roads, government services, and national defense.

Makes a lot of sense.
 
The propagandists try to appeal to the rabble by telling them they could "send in their tax return on a postcard." Maybe, but the postcard would show a much bigger tax payment.

;-)
That's why we routinely get that talk at this time of year, when people are frustrated about doing their taxes, and so simplicity sounds like the most important thing to them.

The thing is, simplicity would be easy to achieve even with a progressive system. You don't need to have a flat tax do have something that could fit onto a postcard. I could (and have) come up with a single formula that you just plug your income into and it spits out your tax liability, but with an effective rate that ramps up as you go up the income ladder. What makes the tax code complicated isn't the bracketing system. Even the far more complicated brackets of past decades easily fit on one page of text. The complexity comes in all the rules about write-offs and carry-forwards and special exceptions. Getting rid of that has nothing at all to do with making taxes flatter. They're two entirely different considerations, but Republicans try to package them together in the public's mind.
 
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