The Collapsing Ukrainian Army
- Thread starter georgephillip
- Start date
georgephillip
Senator
"Putin has the ability to level Kyiv and Trump is keeping Ukraine from responding in kind..." sounds like you believe Trump is preventing Ukraine from leveling Moscow.
If so, how many Americans would be slaughtered in their hometowns in retaliation?
Responding in kind could easily be consistent with their current policy of targeting military targets and infrastructure...
I would never suggest Ukraine target hospitals, churches, schools, apartment blocks and playgrounds....however, I would love to see Russian citizens going without electricity or sleep as explosions at oil depots and factories become bullseyes.
Putin isn't about attacking the US....although given Trump's spineless response to the Iranian missile attack on the US base in Iraq might just tell him he could expect the same kind of response.
georgephillip
Senator
"Putin has the ability to level Kyiv and Trump is keeping Ukraine from responding in kind..." sounds like you believe Trump is preventing Ukraine from leveling Moscow.
If so, how many Americans would be slaughtered in their hometowns in retaliation?
Ukraine has been targeting schools, churches, hospitals, apartments, and playgrounds since 2014; Nazis do those sort of "good guys" things.
Ukraine will never surrender..
Prove it...Numerous videos of Russian atrocity's and war crimes.You babble about Ukraine's.......................PROVE IT
Raoul_Luke
"Wait, it's all Marxism?" "Always has been."
The neocons lied to Ukraine about their chances of winning the war with Russia just exactly like they did about their chances of being welcomed into the EU. It was all an elaborate hoax to get them to sacrifice themselves in a proxy war against Russia to effect regime change by weakening its military in a prolonged conflict that has only accomplished Ukraine getting "wrecked.".
EatTheRich
President
Bottom line, Ukraine had no way of avoiding a war with a Russian war machine that stops only when the ruling secret-police dictatorship, which is absolutely war-dependent, falls. If Russia were allowed to annex Ukraine without resistance, that would only mean the theater of Russia’s war to conquer Europe moving to Lithuania or Poland.
georgephillip
Senator
I think the "good guys" fully expected the Russian economy to collapse during the first year of Putin's SMO. When that didn't happen, the old Western goal of destroying Russia simply moved on to its next tactical move:
"Although Russia has never attacked the West in its centuries-old history and has always been eager to cooperate with it, it has had to defend itself against Western attacks on several occasions: by the Livonian Order in 1240-1242, by Sweden in 1708-1709, by France in 1812, by Germany in 1914-1918 and in 1941-1945, by Ukraine as a proxy of the United States in 2022 until today.
"Indeed, the Western powers saw and/or consider Russia as a competitive superpower. Since industrialization, it has also been realized that Russia possesses countless raw materials in gigantic quantities.
"Thus, the Western powers wanted and still want to have access to Russia's immeasurable mineral resources, because they are necessary for their industry."
https://www.geopolitika.ru/en/article/old-western-dream-destruction-russia
EatTheRich
President
Russia’s economy collapsed prior to the invasion, and only permanent war is keeping it on life support. Russia was the aggressor in the Great Northern War and the Crimean War, and the Great Game was all about Russian imperial ambitions clashing with those of the English. Russia was a WWI belligerent, while the USSR launched reactionary invasions of Hungary and Czechoslovakia and backed Saddam Hussein’s brutal counterrevolutionary attack on Iran. More recently, Russia backed the murderous Milosevic regime and invaded Georgia and Ukraine. Russia now serves, as it served from the period of the Congress of Vienna to the Russian Revolution, as the focal point of world capitalist reaction.
georgephillip
Senator
Where's your evidence for that claim?
https://www.statista.com/chart/3418...m52bx1Z8GMRp_tQBH6bw7Yb0Z09lLbMOjPoFZdT9z3XV2
georgephillip
Senator
So why are Russia's alleged historical missteps justification for America overthrowing a democratically elected government in Kiev and extending the presence of a hostile military alliance to Russian borders?
EatTheRich
President
NATO, the existence of which is unjustifiable and which I will not defend, was on Russia’s borders when Russia became independent.
The U.S. did not overthrow the Yanukovych government. Ukrainian workers, students, peasants, artisans, shopkeepers, and professionals did, over the strong objections of other Ukrainians, and largely in response to his efforts to deprive the voters of meaningful ability to affect the country’s future. The U.S. took an ancillary interest in this grassroots uprising.
The U.S. did not overthrow the Yanukovych government. Ukrainian workers, students, peasants, artisans, shopkeepers, and professionals did, over the strong objections of other Ukrainians, and largely in response to his efforts to deprive the voters of meaningful ability to affect the country’s future. The U.S. took an ancillary interest in this grassroots uprising.
EatTheRich
President
Look at your chart. The only times in 10 years when Russia’s economy put up improving numbers (for, at most, 2 consecutive years) were when Putin invaded Crimea and Donbas, when Russia was buoyed by Trump’s election and the damage it did to the U.S., and when Putin attempted to conquer Kyiv and annex Ukraine.
If true, one wonders why the war didn't end sooner.
Fvck you and me! The MIC is president.
If true, one wonders why the war didn't end sooner.
Fvck you and me! The MIC is president.
Then it's settled.
Will Ukraine bow to Russian aggression?
The right wing is afraid of the answer.
georgephillip
Senator
You claimed the Russian economy collapsed "prior to the invasion."
https://www.statista.com/chart/3418...m52bx1Z8GMRp_tQBH6bw7Yb0Z09lLbMOjPoFZdT9z3XV2
"According to estimates by the International Monetary Fund, Russia’s GDP shrank by 1.2 percent in 2022, following its invasion of Ukraine and the subsequent Western sanctions on its energy, finance and tech sectors.
"However, GDP growth rebounded in 2023 and 2024, by 3.6 percent and 3.8 percent, respectively, far outpacing that of many Western countries those years."
