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WE WON!!!

Craig said:
Consider the various cans of worms.

Say...Apple or MicroSoft decides it's an organization based on the pacifist aspects of a religion, any religion. They then argue that their employees don't need to pay any moneys taxed for warring purposes, as it violates their religious belief. Cool?
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Funny...that hasn't happened. And now we think that will happen because you can't force others to pay for abortions and life ending drugs?

As for the cans of worms, maybe Obama Pelosi and Sebilius should have considered that before they opened can number one. Hmmmm?
 
Sgt Staples said:
Nice spin. Hobby lobby isn't forcing their religious beliefs on anyone.

Their workers are perfectly free to use birth control if they choose. And Hobby Lobby can't be forced to provide it for them if they choose.

It's what we use to call "Liberty."

Kind of an old fashion concept, I know.

Fascists probably wouldn't understand it.



Maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel. Religious and financial liberty took a bit step in the right direction; being returned to us from the fascist Obama administration.
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You don't think that is next. Corporations now can do what they want to their employees. You better hope your son or daughter get hired by one that is controlled by the same religious beliefs as the owners believe in. If not they could be left out in the cold as far as promotions are concerned. So to get ahead you will have to believe in the religion that the owners of your corporation wants and is that not taking away your religious right to choose.
 
Figjam said:
...oooo, but that would be un-American because republicans love war!

...you are right Craig, this "piecemeal" approach to who gets to allow what based on "religious" beliefs is a problem. As I noted to Al, what if they were Christian Scientists who fundamentally believe that diseases are not real, and can be healed with focused prayer from one of their “practitioners.”?
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Onward Christian Soldiers!

The decision strikes me more as a "Corporate Freedom" law as opposed to a "religious freedom" law. Align with a religion and use it to avoid whatever it you want to avoid.
 
Oh Happy Day!

Anything that hurts Unions, I'm for.

Tenure was ruled illegal in California and will now undergo a SCOTUS test. Lets hope Tenure falls within the next year, that will be the start of getting rid of the Teachers stranglehold on education.
 
Figjam said:
...oooo, but that would be un-American because republicans love war!

...you are right Craig, this "piecemeal" approach to who gets to allow what based on "religious" beliefs is a problem. As I noted to Al, what if they were Christian Scientists who fundamentally believe that diseases are not real, and can be healed with focused prayer from one of their “practitioners.”?
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If this were a Christian Scientist company, their employees would STILL be able to purchase health insurance, wouldn't they? Hobby Lobby employees can STILL purchase abortifaciants and abortions. So what's your point?
 
IndependentinWis said:
You don't think that is next. Corporations now can do what they want to their employees. You better hope your son or daughter get hired by one that is controlled by the same religious beliefs as the owners believe in. If not they could be left out in the cold as far as promotions are concerned. So to get ahead you will have to believe in the religion that the owners of your corporation wants and is that not taking away your religious right to choose.
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That is absolutely crazy. If what you say were to occur, that would be a violation of the law. The employee would have more than enough grounds for a lawsuit, if they were actually held back due to a religious difference from their employer.

Christ, you people will use any stupid example to allow the violation of religious liberty.

You would deny religious liberty to the employer while granting it to the employee. That is what we call unequal treatment under the law.

Maybe you would prefer Cuba?
 
Figjam said:
...oooo, but that would be un-American because republicans love war!

...you are right Craig, this "piecemeal" approach to who gets to allow what based on "religious" beliefs is a problem. As I noted to Al, what if they were Christian Scientists who fundamentally believe that diseases are not real, and can be healed with focused prayer from one of their “practitioners.”?
Click to expand...

We don't love WAR but at least we fight to Win!...the things you wingers will say! to defend your hatred of the constitution!
 
Figjam said:
...I don't hate the supreme court - in this instance I believe they are wrong - and I believe that a company should not have a right to limit access to health care based on their personal religious beliefs. So what's next? An employer who is a Christian Scientist refuses to allow their employees to have health coverage because, Christian Scientists fundamentally believe that diseases are not real, and can be healed with focused prayer from one of their “practitioners.”?
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YES. because with these awesome exchanges, an employee is free to go get his/.her own healhtcare on their terms and forgo the benefit that is offered by the employer.
 
Figjam said:
...I choose to live in America - you seem to favor religious oppression which we should not allow here.
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No that's just left winger talk, made up in your littl;e lefty mind which cant conceive much else but what winger wants to believe.
 
Sgt Staples said:
This has nothing to do with the security of the country. And if you are a conscientious objector, you don't have to fight a war. And if you think about it, you don't have to pay taxes if you don't want to either. Just stay below the taxable minimum in income.
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It has to do with corporate decisions in regards their employees.

Corporate...not individual. Apple. Microsoft. Any massive corporation. Bill Gates says he's a religious man and his religion says no war. Then...any dollar dedicated to the the military from every employee in the entire MS workforce is then exempt from that percentage of taxation. That's 127,000 well paid employees who can now say they don't want to pay for...war...

Again, this is just one example of the path this decision takes us down.

Pick any other consideration in the tax base. Now, every company aligned with a religion gets to decide what it wants to pay for based upon their "religion".
 
Craig said:
Onward Christian Soldiers!

The decision strikes me more as a "Corporate Freedom" law as opposed to a "religious freedom" law. Align with a religion and use it to avoid whatever it you want to avoid.
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Ok produce their manifesto...show me where it says that!
 
gigi said:
Funny...that hasn't happened. And now we think that will happen because you can't force others to pay for abortions and life ending drugs?

As for the cans of worms, maybe Obama Pelosi and Sebilius should have considered that before they opened can number one. Hmmmm?
Click to expand...

hasn't happened? Well...since the ruling came down like...20 minutes ago, what exactly are you expecting?
 
Craig said:
It has to do with corporate decisions in regards their employees.

Corporate...not individual. Apple. Microsoft. Any massive corporation. Bill Gates says he's a religious man and his religion says no war. Then...any dollar dedicated to the the military from every employee in the entire MS workforce is then exempt from that percentage of taxation. That's 127,000 well paid employees who can now say they don't want to pay for...war...

Again, this is just one example of the path this decision takes us down.

Pick any other consideration in the tax base. Now, every company aligned with a religion gets to decide what it wants to pay for based upon their "religion".
Click to expand...

WAAAAAHHHHH....WAAAAAHHHHHHH!

Yes but Corporations are people...so you can sue them when they commit a foul....sheesh tell me your not that stupid....and then back it up please...you haven't yet.
 
Craig said:
Onward Christian Soldiers!

The decision strikes me more as a "Corporate Freedom" law as opposed to a "religious freedom" law. Align with a religion and use it to avoid whatever it you want to avoid.
Click to expand...

Good point, Craig.. this read gives examples of some of these possibilties..
_______________________

Even a ruling that says Hobby Lobby can eliminate one part of healthcare for its employees would be extremely dangerous because the conservatives on the Court would signal again that they give more weight to corporate interests than women’s right to healthcare and freedom from religious imposition. The real danger is that in setting a precedent of “free exercise of religious domination,” the conservatives on the Court will open the floodgates for anyone, corporation, small business, or private individual to use “religious freedom” to discriminate against anyone and flout any law.

For example, a business owner can can claim paying a woman or person of color minimum wage violates their religious belief that women or people of color are only worth a dollar-an-hour. A bigot can claim that being arrested for stoning gays violates their religious freedom, or a fundamentalist Muslim can claim they were exercising religious freedom when they killed their daughter for being raped. It is why the High Court must make explaining what religious freedom means their first order of business; tragically, that appears to be highly unlikely.
http://www.politicususa.com/2014/06/29/idiotic-personhood-giving-corporation-religious-freedom.html
 
Drumcollie said:
NO!..Your challenge not mine...burden of proof lays on you buddy...get your lazy ass to work!
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No...as I proposed a hypothetical, my work is done. There are religions with pacifist ideals, so the concept is not far flung. There are varying degrees of pacifist thought among Christian sects. Just war is also a concept, and that requires certain considerations as well. Not every military action is just, nor even justified.
 
Craig said:
Consider the various cans of worms.

Say...Apple or MicroSoft decides it's an organization based on the pacifist aspects of a religion, any religion. They then argue that their employees don't need to pay any moneys taxed for warring purposes, as it violates their religious belief. Cool?
Click to expand...

Yep, it's a slippery slope they just went down with no end in sight. Hopefully one of those Con SCOTUS rubes retires in the next 2.5 years.
 
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