Why I am now anti-abortion

[gigi]

Drowning a born child is illegal. So no.

Abortion used to be illegal,too.
The fact that it is now legal doesn't make it any less the killing of a human being than drowning a born child is.

But when abortion was not legal, advocates for it pushed for that change. And the argument was, that women were dying by doing this illegal thing so it should be legal. I imagine you're glad that people spoke up about a change in the law they felt should come.
Following that same tactic, I'll say to you that women are killing their children by legal means and it should be illegal to kill your child. We're simply advocating for a change in the law in order to spare children from being killed at the hands of another. .

As it stands now, there are people who advocate for giving parents the right to kill their born children up to two years after birth, in the event that they find parenting isn't for them, or discover that the child has a disability. In Holland it's a common practice for parents of disabled children to euthanize their kids. In fact, parents of disabled kids who don't euthanize are criticized for being selfish.

The fact is, Bobby, regardless of what laws you want to hide behind, killing a defenseless human being is killing a human being.

 

[gigi]

Hmmmm. TV stars and Internet trolls. Well, that's a crowd to hang with.

Both are people. And the comments Grammar received are pretty nasty and indicative of the pro abortion mindset.

 

[BobbyT]

Both are people. And the comments Grammar received are pretty nasty and indicative of the pro abortion mindset.

Yeah, I see a lot of nasty comments on a lot of different websites. I don't think they're indicative of anything except that people feel free to be [Unwelcome language removed] when anonymous. You can take any stance on any issue (or just express what's going on in your daily life) and get a lot of comments from shitheads who think leaving vile comments is amusing. So what.

 

[BobbyT]

Abortion used to be illegal,too.
The fact that it is now legal doesn't make it any less the killing of a human being than drowning a born child is.

But when abortion was not legal, advocates for it pushed for that change. And the argument was, that women were dying by doing this illegal thing so it should be legal. I imagine you're glad that people spoke up about a change in the law they felt should come.
Following that same tactic, I'll say to you that women are killing their children by legal means and it should be illegal to kill your child. We're simply advocating for a change in the law in order to spare children from being killed at the hands of another. .

As it stands now, there are people who advocate for giving parents the right to kill their born children up to two years after birth, in the event that they find parenting isn't for them, or discover that the child has a disability. In Holland it's a common practice for parents of disabled children to euthanize their kids. In fact, parents of disabled kids who don't euthanize are criticized for being selfish.

The fact is, Bobby, regardless of what laws you want to hide behind, killing a defenseless human being is killing a human being.

But abortion isn't illegal now. And I support a woman's choice not to be pregnant if she doesn't want to. The fact is, Gigi, you're not going to change my POV no matter what emotion-laden argument you bring to bear because for me it's much more important that women not be shackled to their ability to bear children. Sex will happen. Sometimes pregnancies occur. Sometimes those pregnancies put a great burden on the woman (however any particular woman defines "great burden," it's not my business to judge). I don't put myself in judgement over what a woman decides is right for her life, and if pregnancy isn't right, for whatever reason she chooses, that's enough for me. Woman are fully capable adults with full autonomy over their bodies and their lives and when they choose not to continue their pregnancy, that should be their right. If you want to become den mother to every pregnant woman out there, go for it. But I'm betting most of them would say "no thank you, I am an adult fully capable of making decisions for myself and can take care of my own life."

 

[Max R.]

Sorry, Max, you're wrong: From the link I gave you:

“Fertilization is the process by which male and female haploid gametes (sperm and egg) unite to produce a genetically distinct individual.”

“The oviduct or Fallopian tube is the anatomical region where every new life begins

They're alive.. They have their own unique DNA footprint. They're human. They're human beings....

See, that's where your logic makes a misstep. Alive, unique DNA, human. All true. Human being? Not yet. It's "the process by which" an individual human being is made, but it has to grow to become a human being.

 

[Max R.]

I don't know if anyone else saw the news story. Kelsey Grammar wore an anti-abortion T shirt that read "Would it bother us more if they used guns? Abort73.com"

And some of the comments and tweets he received are disgusting. One such "I used to love you. Now I wish your mother had swallowed you and your wife."

A great question by Grammar which makes hypocrites out of both anti-abortion/pro-gunners and pro-abortion/anti-gunners.

The Abort73 website brings up good questions such as regret. The stats on regret vary, mainly depending upon the specific question and who is asking it, but I strongly believe the best way to prevent abortion is not to get pregnant. This means more focus on education and access to cheap, effective contraceptives. Abortion laws, IMO, should remain as they are, but we can do a lot to reduce how many abortions are performed.

 

[gigi]

A great question by Grammar which makes hypocrites out of both anti-abortion/pro-gunners and pro-abortion/anti-gunners.

The Abort73 website brings up good questions such as regret. The stats on regret vary, mainly depending upon the specific question and who is asking it, but I strongly believe the best way to prevent abortion is not to get pregnant. This means more focus on education and access to cheap, effective contraceptives. Abortion laws, IMO, should remain as they are, but we can do a lot to reduce how many abortions are performed.

It's been forty years now and the access to cheap effective contraception and "Sex Ed" has only increased....along with the abortion rate. Stuff's not being done correctly. The answer is not to give more money to the folks who are blowing it.

Speaking of cheap contraceptives....did you watch the links I put up of Sue Thayer? She was a PP clinic manager for 17 years. Here's how the cheap contraceptives are sold at PP:

PP has a contract with the pharmaceutical companies. They pay about 3 dollars per cycle pack of pills. They bill Medicaid 35 dollars for every cycle pack of pills they give out. Medicaid pays them 23 dollars per. PLUS, PP asks the patients for ten dollar donations "to offset costs" of the pills. Thayer says that often the women feel guilty and pay ten dollars per cycle pack.

Also, every 63 days, PP mails out three cycle packs of pills to each patient of theirs who is on the Pill, regardless of whether the woman wants these or not. PP pays about 9 dollars for the three packs combined. They bill Medicaid about 105 dollars for these three packs....every sixty three days.
If the pills are returned, PP just resells again.

So when you talk about wanting cheap, accessible contraceptives for women, and you talk about maintaining PP's funding, you're contradicting yourself.

 

[Caroljo]

Because one law was passed by women, with certain limitations, and the other was pushed by Lindsey Graham. I'll let figure out which is which.

As it stands, human beings grow. A zygote is no more a human being than the cheek cells I wash down the drain every time I brush my teeth. However, at some point those cells grow into a viable human being and deserve to be protected as such.

Personally, I agree with you that the laws conflict and should be fixed; namely not calling a <24 week fetus a human being that can be "murdered". Better, IMO, to treat such an injury as grievous injury like cutting off someone's arm.

That one sentence is wrong in so many ways (I also don't agree with the rest of what you said either). I hear that from so many people that think they know more than science. From Gigi's link (in case you didn't read it)....

“A zygote is the beginning of a new human being (i.e., an embryo).”

 

[Max R.]

That one sentence is wrong in so many ways (I also don't agree with the rest of what you said either). I hear that from so many people that think they know more than science. From Gigi's link (in case you didn't read it)....

“A zygote is the beginning of a new human being (i.e., an embryo).”

Correct, beginning of a new human being. That doesn't mean it is one, yet.

A seedling is the beginning of an apple tree, but are you really saying they are the same?

If someone ran over your dog, then presented you with a zygote with the DNA of your dog in it, would you be satisfied with that? If not, why not?

 

[JuliefromOhio]

it's all about sex for mere pleasure, isn't it?

LOL

 

[JuliefromOhio]

It seems there are plenty of kneejerk memes afloat about the issue. Call it "fetal tissue" and anything goes. I know from friends and family who have had abortions that there is a psychological and emotional contortion that must occur to justify something the whole God given, God imaged mind of man screams against. It is destructive to mankind and destructive to his civilization. That is not to mention the judgement of God which falls upon a nation that does such sacrifice to evil. I guess no one notices, or maybe the mind just reels, but the evil one has always demanded sacrifice whether from altars on mountains or pyramids or cellars or graveyards or fields of battle or Planned Parenthood abortion clinics. There is plenty of evidence that there are people who are distinctly aware of the nature and purpose and receiver of this sacrifice. And look what happens to the practitioners. Look at the calloused hearts. They are as bad as Hillary Clinton cackling over the death of Muamar Khaddafi.

If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a Sacrament.

 

[Max R.]

View attachment 28330

it's all about sex for mere pleasure, isn't it?

LOL

Nina certainly doesn't like sex for pleasure. She's often posted that anyone who posts about sex is a pervert.

Of course, she mostly says that against RWers so I think she won't comment about your post.

As for me, I like sex for pleasure and never, ever had sex for procreation. How about you, Julie? Only one or the other? Both?

 

[Woolleybugger]

As I was finding the videos for you last night I kept hoping that instead of just blowing them off, you'd at least watch them. Clearly you're copping out. You can say what you want about the people at Liveaction, but nothing you say will change the fact that the employees of these clinics are saying what they're saying on those videos. And it's a shame that you have been so indoctrinated by the pro abortion folks that you can't even bring yourself to watch a video.

If you gave me a video, I'd at least watch it before declaring it BS. But then again, I'm not scared of having my house of cards knocked down.
I hope you change your mind and at least watch them.

I dont bother with propaganda, sorry.

 

[Woolleybugger]

define "health of the Mother." Is a headache an excuse for a late term abortion? The fact is, that rarely if ever, is the health of the mother in jeopardy if she was healthy during the full term of the pregnancy. And this bill was just to insure that an infant born alive during an abortion would receive medical care.

That is up to the mother, her family and her doctor, not you Sarge.

 

[Woolleybugger]

And slavery and segregation were upheld as rights, too. What's your point? Were the victims of those real or not?
Sometimes America makes mistakes.

Equating slavery, the ownership of human beings supported by the state, the law and the constitution with aborting a fetus is patently absurd. One of these days your pro-lifers are going to spend your precious Jesus inspired time on preventing the deaths of real people. If you want to prevent deaths, try supporting gun control, cancer research, peace, wellness care, universal heath coverage...you know, stuff that people need to stay alive.

 

[gigi]

I dont bother with propaganda, sorry.

Well, Woolley, PP has announced that they will no longer take money for the body parts of their victims. I'm sure that they'll get the money from their clients into their coffers somehow. But once again, PP responds publicly by addressing the issues uncovered in these videos even as the faithful yell "propaganda!"

 

[gigi]

Equating slavery, the ownership of human beings supported by the state, the law and the constitution with aborting a fetus is patently absurd. One of these days your pro-lifers are going to spend your precious Jesus inspired time on preventing the deaths of real people. If you want to prevent deaths, try supporting gun control, cancer research, peace, wellness care, universal heath coverage...you know, stuff that people need to stay alive.

You mean, try abandoning the voiceless unborn and instead think just as you do, don't you?
I work with people in the prolife community who think no one should own a gun. I personally do support many of the things you mentioned, as do many of my fellows. What I don't support is the sleight of hand nonsense that you folks continually try to peddle; It all hinges on the unhinged idea that if you care about the unborn, you don't care about anyone else. It's a lie but you knew that. What you don't know is that it's old and over.

You were always real, Woolley, from your conception, to now, and beyond. You were never fake.

 

[Woolleybugger]

You mean, try abandoning the voiceless unborn and instead think just as you do, don't you?
I work with people in the prolife community who think no one should own a gun. I personally do support many of the things you mentioned, as do many of my fellows. What I don't support is the sleight of hand nonsense that you folks continually try to peddle; It all hinges on the unhinged idea that if you care about the unborn, you don't care about anyone else. It's a lie but you knew that. What you don't know is that it's old and over.

You were always real, Woolley, from your conception, to now, and beyond. You were never fake.

Good for you, you actually care about people, real people, not blobs of cells going through various stages of looking like lizards, pigs and chickens. I forgot newts, we look like newts at one stage. I got news for you whack jobs, you are not a human being without a brain, a fully formed brain. The rest is just tissue, organs, cells and various quasi-amphibian inspired metamorphosing unorganized tissue.

 

[gigi]

Good for you, you actually care about people, real people, not blobs of cells going through various stages of looking like lizards, pigs and chickens. I forgot newts, we look like newts at one stage. I got news for you whack jobs, you are not a human being without a brain, a fully formed brain. The rest is just tissue, organs, cells and various quasi-amphibian inspired metamorphosing unorganized tissue.

Only a wackjob would refuse to call a living human being "human" because of how he or she looks at various stages in his or her life. And I see another wackjob liked what you had to say.

We're all blobs of cells going through various stages and changes in life. You always were you.

Get used to us "wack jobs" because we're not going away. And life is beginning to win. The little girls aren't piling in at the abortion mills like they used to.

 

[gigi]

And again....Planned Parenthood has once more acted to correct a heinous practice that has been revealed on video. But you go ahead and keep calling it "propaganda". What you insist on telling yourself has not made one bit of difference.