Recent changes to mods etc :)

[Dave]

As you have noticed, Minotaur and Jen now have the "Lead Moderator" denotation beneath their name. Let me explain to you just what that means. Jen and Minotaur are an added piece of the Chain of Command we have established for Political Jack. They are the bridge between Moderators and Administration. There are times that I cannot be here to oversee and complete some tasks that need to be done, so I have given Minotaur and Jen the ability to answer/ complete those tasks for me when that happens in that they are aware of what I would do in most situations.

You are able to address any questions or problems of posting on or navigating Political Jack boards to them and they will give you prompt answers. If they have questions or doubts about what should happen they will get the final word on those things from me.

Please continue to use the reporting system when you see someone break a rule and all the mods will address the issue

 

[Angel of Dearth]

So Dave, I was wondering. . .

How do you ensure posting standards are applied equally across LoC and RoC posters?

The quick answer seems deeply flawed:

RoC mods recommend/suggest/issue infractions to RoC posters and LoC mods do the same for LoC posters.

Hopefully, you can see how deeply flawed that approach is even after you layer on the expected excuses and apologies: The administrator has the final say in all infractions and can overrule any warning/infraction/banning/measure and all related stop gaps.

The whole idea of fairness in posting rests on the lynch pin of having common standards. No common standards, no fairness is even possible. And so while you can point to the posting rules of PJ and confidently proclaim:

There be our standards!

you have no way of ensuring those standards are being enforced by equal measures across LoCs and RoCs alike. It would appear you simply laid out some (ever changing) standards, assigned mods, turned your back, and hoped for the best. But here's the crux:

What if lefties and righties value standards differently?

Waitaminute! They DO value standards differently! In fact. . .the difference in standards is one of the key differences between the left and the right!

Morality. Is that a left or a right thing? Don't be coy. The left is proud of their atheist heritage. Religion has always been a tool of the oppressors in the left's eye.

Utilitarianism. Left or right? Saul Alinsky dusted off the "ends justify the means," gave it a fresh coat of paint and it is now mainstream left. Righties are the "principled" ones who eschew utilitarianism while lefties embrace it and call themselves "pragmatic" and "problem solvers" because of it.

And so with morality and hence a desire to adhere to true standards on the right and utilitarianism for the sake of power on the left you have put the pillars of the community on the right in charge of judging the other pillars while putting the criminals on the left in charge of judging other criminals. Those who cling to standards will readily admonish themselves and issue infractions while the utilitarian--the "pragmatic" ones--on the left will see through the silly principles hampering their rightie counterparts and not be so encumbered by them. They will not be so inclined to issue infractions to themselves. After all, they're lefties. They know better. They can't be held to the same standards that those luddite righties have.

You have built bias into the system. You've written down "standards" for PJ but the left and right value standards in a fundamentally different way. If I had my way, not a single RoC poster would participate in this ridiculous mod scheme you've built.

 

[bdtex]

"Chain of Command". Cool! Maybe you should change the posting level designations to military ranks. We can call all the newbies "FNG".

 

[Woolleybugger]

Wow. You need to take a break from this stuff AoD. This is only one of millions of boards on the internet. If Dave wants to make folks moderators, he has every right to do so in any way he wants. Your rant then descends into madness once you get to morality tales. Lefties are atheists therefore they have no values. Alinksy is the Wizard of Oz dictating our behavior when responding to posts on an obscure board...this is not the output of a rational human being in full control of his faculties.

 

[bdtex]

I hear Dave is planning on hiring Muslim administrators and instituting Sharia Law in PoliticalJack.

 

[Queen Titania]

Yer but do 'friends' have to become Mods ? Or Leader Mods ? Who it seems now will at times have the 'powers' of Judge and Jury as well as Police persons...................... But it is not my business what they choose to do ..... Many a State was built on such tactics.

 

[PhilFish]

so, i'm intrigued... how do you envision a solution...that would not garner the moniker of 'police state'

example: if in the context of an exchange in a post one poster calls another an a**hole, or some other derogatory... what is a mod (friend, or other) to do...so as not to seem to be 'policing'

 

[Queen Titania]

When the Mods came up as a solution, I think we all had reservations about it but understood the whys and the wherefores.

And it was discussed at length if I remember rightly. It never truly affected me so I said little then.

But this new post of 'Leader of the Mods', it seems to me is our 'reservations' come true.

I am never involved in any squabbles, that I remember anyway, but when I look at the experiment it seems to me the real problem was over quite a while back, now this to me is overload .............. but it is just an experiment and fine, cool I doubt it will affect me personally so why should I care but I do question it ......that is not to say I have an answer but if one does not question a thing when one is so inclined who knows where it mught end ?

Like, what Admin ? I didn't get an answer too before ....now I do. So OK I'll shut up .................not my business.

 

[Greenridgeman]

To comment would be self-moderating.

I already got busted for that for speaking my mind on how issues like you address are handled.

 

[Greenridgeman]

How do you ensure posting standards are applied equally across LoC and RoC posters?


I know how I am trying to ensure fairness, and freedom of speech here.

I am contacting advertisers, and asking them to do a little reading of the site they spend their money on.

 

[Minotaur]

My view but I can say both sides say that about the "other side" Moderators. Even Moderators new to reports confuse that until they gain experience and understand we only deal with true rule breaks. Can't really fix that impression particularly because Moderators are not able to edit what a poster really didn't like - just clear cut rule breaks. Best answer is posters are adults so they have to assume we know that and avoid over-moderating just because a poster is sensitive to what "the other side" said that does not break a rule no matter how certain they are a rule was broken. Won't even try to convince on this as it is unlikely to change what a poster "knows" as a certainty no matter the reality. It is what it is.

Maybe the real fix is for posters who think like this to really study the rules and see how basic some of this is. Those who really know the rules do send very good reports on actual rule breaks. Posters who know the rules tend to report "You are a LIAR" and posters reporting with a misunderstanding of rules tend to report "You are not being fully honest in this". Both feel they are being called a liar and breaking a rule. Only one does break a rule. To know the difference will go a long way in posters themselves answering the question about one side doing more.

 

[Minotaur]

My advice is this: Just PM a list of constructive suggestions to any Moderator. Any good ideas can be forwarded to Jen or myself for review and if a suggestion is well founded it can even be included as an additional aspect of Fairness to ALL posters. We do not respond to emotional arguments about sides or any of the invented oddities a poster may decide that other side is. Some of the best ideas we currently use have come from posters who only had a wish to help make PJ a great place for EVERYONE to post in. We are always open.

Very often Fair to a poster means Fair to their own side. That is what we avoid. It must be Fair for all posters to be Fair. Hope this helps.

 

[Jen]

Greenie, the moderators act as a non-partisan board and each report turned in is seen and can be commented on (as to what should be done) by both sides. One side takes action, but all sides comment and suggest what the action should be.

If you see that someone you know is RoC deals with your post that was turned in by a lefty, be assured that ALL moderators had the opportunity to see what you did and comment on how serious or not-serious it was.

The same goes for any post against a liberal........... RoC moderators may not do the final action, but we certainly do comment as to what should be done and LoC moderators who DO the action consider what we have said.

That's how we ensure that fairness and equality happen.

 

[MaryAnne]

My view but I can say both sides say that about the "other side" Moderators. Even Moderators new to reports confuse that until they gain experience and understand we only deal with true rule breaks. Can't really fix that impression particularly because Moderators are not able to edit what a poster really didn't like - just clear cut rule breaks. Best answer is posters are adults so they have to assume we know that and avoid over-moderating just because a poster is sensitive to what "the other side" said that does not break a rule no matter how certain they are a rule was broken. Won't even try to convince on this as it is unlikely to change what a poster "knows" as a certainty no matter the reality. It is what it is.

Maybe the real fix is for posters who think like this to really study the rules and see how basic some of this is. Those who really know the rules do send very good reports on actual rule breaks. Posters who know the rules tend to report "You are a LIAR" and posters reporting with a misunderstanding of rules tend to report "You are not being fully honest in this". Both feel they are being called a liar and breaking a rule. Only one does break a rule. To know the difference will go a long way in posters themselves answering the question about one side doing more.

Hey Min,I will keep AOD's words in my mind when I am in Church this week.The thought that comes to mind is Corinthians ,second chapter, 5Th verse "That you not put your faith in the wisdom of man,but in God's power!")

 

[Bo-4]

Wow. You need to take a break from this stuff AoD. This is only one of millions of boards on the internet. If Dave wants to make folks moderators, he has every right to do so in any way he wants. Your rant then descends into madness once you get to morality tales. Lefties are atheists therefore they have no values. Alinksy is the Wizard of Oz dictating our behavior when responding to posts on an obscure board...this is not the output of a rational human being in full control of his faculties.

Poor AoD just hasn't been himself since the Mod thing started. Personally, i don't get it.