Say it ain't so...

[Minotaur]

It's interesting - and a little breathtaking! - if we go back to the beginning of road and air travel in the U.S. and total up the LITERALLY Trillions of dollars we've invested over the last 100 years, in getting those technologies up and running and viable.

I'm not prepared to suggest those investments weren't worthwile. I'm not sure anyone is. But then...to turn around and suggest that new tech like high-speed rail MUST make its own way - entirely at the "ticket booth"?....is silly and disengenuous.

We will always have cost with infrastructure so it is a part of being an advanced and very large country where the government is concerned. Commuter trains do the private, for profit with government subsidies already with Amtrac so it is not as undo-able as it may sound. In fact all transportations are going to have a huge investment to make very soon as our way of doing business is falling behind, deteriorating and costing more than can be sustained. It is heady stuff but I think if there is interest it will be a thing eventually done. I love that Jerry Brown has the interest in developing the idea. We are a little late to the waterhole.

 

[Barbella]

Having lived in Germany for the first 20 years of my life, I have to admit that trains DO have their advantages, especially when they're clean, safe, and on time. Then again....that's in Germany, where most everything is as efficient as it's supposed to be....LOL

 

[ya-ta-hey]

Miss Yatahey is stuck on taa taa's on bulls. LOL I'll let her play. ;-)

Mr. Minotaur,

Bulls do not have ta-tas. Hope that little bit of zoology helps.

 

[Minotaur]

Having lived in Germany for the first 20 years of my life, I have to admit that trains DO have their advantages, especially when they're clean, safe, and on time. Then again....that's in Germany, where most everything is as efficient as it's supposed to be....LOL

The bullet trains in China shocked me as I figured my hair would whip back! Who knew there is no motion or centrifugal force? Reality never meets expectations! Those trains are so smooth it is hard to tell you are even moving. Very enjoyable and we got up to around 220 MPH (got a picture of it when it hit that). Yes clean and safe would be very, very nice. LOL

 

[fairsheet]

The "state" owns our roads. Our cars are privately owned. The state owns the air and airports, but the planes are privately owned and operated. A lot of us - from various points on the spectrum - are beginning to appreciate the wisdom of our building a national, 21st-Century energy grid, into which private producers might distribute their products.

Maybe?..there's a way of the state building and operating the tracks, such that private entities would be encouraged to provide and run the trains?

 

[connieb]

I think that this is one of those things that sounds great, but is just not practical considering the way Americans like to travel. In many cases local commuter options are financial loosers too.

I see one poster mentioned Boston/NY/DC. And, we have something already - The Ocella. But, man it is pricey. And, not all THAT fast. And, due to the mostly urban routes that exist for the Ocella, I can see where we would never be able to turn that into a bullet route because there just is not that much open space to really get up to that super fast speed to significanly cut the commute time.

But, rail travel even though less hassle is still not without hassel. You have to get to and park at a station, get transportation when you get off the train. There is generally additonal cab fees and parking fees at your drop off location, etc.

The thing is that yes - it is a time saver/money saver compared to air travel. But, it is not necessarily a time/money saver over driving your own car depending on the routes/locations and accessibility of stations. HS Rail may work in locations where the road infrastructure is bad, and access to reliable vehicles is difficult. But, faced with a 4 hour drive to NY in the comfort of my own car when I can listen to my own music and drink coffee and have a snack all on my own schedule OR take a train, cut the actual travel time in half, but add the extra head-aches of traveling out of my way to a train station, parking in a less than desireable area, making my way with all my crap through the stations, down the escalators, cramming onto a train, then having to sit next to strangers who will likely take up too much space, smell or be rude or all three, while not being able to eat or drink in my seat ( many of our commuter vehciles do not allow food - and "clean" is an issue if you allow food), so that I can get off the train and then try to find ground transportation or walk many many blocks all while dragging my necessary bags and briefcase, etc - all on the train's schedule by the way... I will choose my own car every time.


connie

 

[Minotaur]

Mr. Minotaur,

Bulls do not have ta-tas. Hope that little bit of zoology helps.

The fly in your ointment is you are unfamiliar with great poetry. Sometimes Minotaur is ta ta-less, sometimes it is a poem. Your focus on ta ta's is not going to be rewarded.

It is one of my favorite poem. It could have been worse, I could have named myself Chaos which is another favorite, or worse, Bluebeard. There are no ta ta's in poems. ;-)

 

[ya-ta-hey]

The fly in your ointment is you are unfamiliar with great poetry. Sometimes Minotaur is ta ta-less, sometimes it is a poem. Your focus on ta ta's is not going to be rewarded.

It is one of my favorite poem. It could have been worse, I could have named myself Chaos which is another favorite, or worse, Bluebeard. There are no ta ta's in poems. ;-)

Ms. (although the name confuses) Minotaur,

Robert Herrick begs to differ:

Display thy bre..asts, my Julia dear, there let me
Behold that curcummortal purity;
Between those glories, there my lips I'll lay
Ravished in thy fair Via lactea

 

[Minotaur]

Ms. (although the name confuses) Minotaur,

Robert Herrick begs to differ:

Display thy bre..asts, my Julia dear, there let me
Behold that curcummortal purity;
Between those glories, there my lips I'll lay
Ravished in thy fair Via lactea

Well poetry is the only thing that could have dug you out of ta ta-gate and you survived for it. As we see poetry is a powerful defensive weapon even when it is poetic boobs. LOL

 

[fairsheet]

I think that this is one of those things that sounds great, but is just not practical considering the way Americans like to travel. In many cases local commuter options are financial loosers too.

I see one poster mentioned Boston/NY/DC. And, we have something already - The Ocella. But, man it is pricey. And, not all THAT fast. And, due to the mostly urban routes that exist for the Ocella, I can see where we would never be able to turn that into a bullet route because there just is not that much open space to really get up to that super fast speed to significanly cut the commute time.

But, rail travel even though less hassle is still not without hassel. You have to get to and park at a station, get transportation when you get off the train. There is generally additonal cab fees and parking fees at your drop off location, etc.

The thing is that yes - it is a time saver/money saver compared to air travel. But, it is not necessarily a time/money saver over driving your own car depending on the routes/locations and accessibility of stations. HS Rail may work in locations where the road infrastructure is bad, and access to reliable vehicles is difficult. But, faced with a 4 hour drive to NY in the comfort of my own car when I can listen to my own music and drink coffee and have a snack all on my own schedule OR take a train, cut the actual travel time in half, but add the extra head-aches of traveling out of my way to a train station, parking in a less than desireable area, making my way with all my crap through the stations, down the escalators, cramming onto a train, then having to sit next to strangers who will likely take up too much space, smell or be rude or all three, while not being able to eat or drink in my seat ( many of our commuter vehciles do not allow food - and "clean" is an issue if you allow food), so that I can get off the train and then try to find ground transportation or walk many many blocks all while dragging my necessary bags and briefcase, etc - all on the train's schedule by the way... I will choose my own car every time.


connie

History shows us that the transportation comes first, and the socioeconomic development follows. "Build it and they will come", as they say. The suburbs exist, because we invented the car and built the roads.

That dynamic obviously still applies in a relatively undeveloped state like China. The question WE have to ask ourselves, is if it still applies here in the U.S., or are our geographic and socioeconomic development patterns now so matured and fixed, that transportation can only react to them, rather than drive them?